The I.R. dating disparity

[27727746]

I have been looking into the I.R. dating disparity (why it exists, what are it's consequences, and what we can do about it) from an evolutionary perspective and I'm hoping that your answers will prevent me from missing any angles. This is very important to me and I would greatly appreciate everyone's feedback on the following questions.
1) What are the major causes (in order of importance) of the I.R. dating disparity?
2) What is it's long term impact?
3) What you would do to correct it?

[kwak76]

search function.

[Heyyu]

1) What are the major causes (in order of importance) of the I.R. dating disparity?
2) What is it's long term impact?
3) What you would do to correct it?

I'm not going into #1 (cause we've had too many discussions about it on this board), but in terms of #2, I actually think in the long-term the USA and the world is moving towards a multi-racial society (like South America). I mean, in the States, 1/3 of the people are racial minorities and by 2050 whites will be less than 50% of the US population.

As for Asians in America, all the hapa kids they're pumping out will be the future face of Asian-America. A lot of future hapa's will go through that identity crisis (i.e. Not White enough for Whites, yet not Asian enough to use chopsticks). I also think there'll be more diversity from Hapa kids than the typical Asian/White combination we see now.

I think intermarriages between Asian and Latinos will increase in the States. Both groups are a demographic time bomb waiting to happen. #1. Latino males can look quite white, which would be appealing to Asian chicks #2. For Asian guys, I think Latina females are generally more open-minded about dating different races than your typical white chick or Asian chick. Not to mention the general hotness of Latina girls: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1103/heyyu/Paula%20Garces/john_cho19.jpg

[Ike]

2) What is it's long term impact?

Fragmentation of the Asian American "community".

[thmilin]

I'm not going into #1 (cause we've had too many discussions about it on this board), but in terms of #2, I actually think in the long-term the USA and the world is moving towards a multi-racial society (like South America). I mean, in the States, 1/3 of the people are racial minorities and by 2050 whites will be less than 50% of the US population.

As for Asians in America, all the hapa kids they're pumping out will be the future face of Asian-America. A lot of future hapa's will go through that identity crisis (i.e. Not White enough for Whites, yet not Asian enough to use chopsticks). I also think there'll be more diversity from Hapa kids than the typical Asian/White combination we see now.

I think intermarriages between Asian and Latinos will increase in the States. Both groups are a demographic time bomb waiting to happen. #1. Latino males can look quite white, which would be appealing to Asian chicks #2. For Asian guys, I think Latina females are generally more open-minded about dating different races than your typical white chick or Asian chick. Not to mention the general hotness of Latina girls: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1103/heyyu/Paula%20Garces/john_cho19.jpg

i agree:

- i think the world is moving toward "a little bit of visible brown" in everyone, like in south america, which you point out. and there it is perfectly acceptable to see all variations of colors mixing together without the same level of racist tension. however, that is not to say that racist tension doesn't exist. full assimilation of asians into south america hasn't occurred yet, so we have to wait to see how that works out to have the "full story."

- re: latinos + asians:

a friend once told me "filipinos are nothin but asian mexicans." and dude, it's true. colonialism has a lot of ethnic groups mirroring. filipinos began with spanish colonization of a southeast asian aboriginal group, sprinkling in neighboring asian groups. mexicans began with spanish colonialization of a south american aboriginal group. true, there wasn't a sprinkling of nearby asian groups, but there is a reason filipinos and mexicans can be mistaken for each other.

so there's a reason some asians, who find filipino ladies hot, are gonna find latinas hot, eh?

- re: hapas, and hapas expanding to asian + black

you are damn skippy. i want to move this board away from assuming white+asian is the only mix, i'm amused to find this stereotype here, then again, i recognize that i'm a minority so the majority would make its assumption based on what it's seen or personally experienced. you may of course be more concerned with issues of the asian female/white male, which of course would therefore be more prevalent in your mind, than mine. but anyway, yes ...

y'all are seriously falling behind on the times! catch up.

i read somewhere black males have been a pretty heavy contingent for the US military since vietnam and am thinking that every time you see an AF/WM couple in your mind you should add an AF/BM beside them. personally my own mother married and had children by BOTH a white AND a black man (not at the same time, heh) so ... we've got to stretch the default response on that.

I know there's the white privilege issue, and i agree with it, but that does not mean the other pairing doesn't exist or is less important, in terms of asian-american consciousness, racial issues, and interracial dating disparity ...

maybe you aren't seeing it where you live but the black hapas are already in their first generation of adulthood. adult black hapas are already starting to mix with other ethnicities like you mention. the black hapas are male and female and are marrying white, asian, latino, and black males and females.

so like you say ... this bucket is gonna get more stirred up, mang.

[Heyyu]

i agree:

- i think the world is moving toward "a little bit of visible brown" in everyone, like in south america, which you point out. and there it is perfectly acceptable to see all variations of colors mixing together without the same level of racist tension. however, that is not to say that racist tension doesn't exist. full assimilation of asians into south america hasn't occurred yet, so we have to wait to see how that works out to have the "full story."

In the case of South America, there seems to be differing levels of "shades." But the general rule holds true in South America like it does anywhere else in the world: The "lighter" you are, the "higher" your status and the "darker" you are, the "lower" your status. You'll find this also holds true in the Middle East, in India, even in Africa... I still can't decide if this is more due to Western colonialism or an innate human tendency to prefer lighter skin-tones in humans. I think it's a bit of both actually.

As for the Asian + Black Hapa combination... of course they exist! Famous examples include Tiger Woods, former Super Bowl MVP Hines Ward, Naomi Campbell (who's more like 1/4 Hapa), etc. But out of the total Asian Hapa population, they still constitute a small although growing minority.

A majority of Asian Hapa combinations are still pretty much white + Asian. Again, I'd like to see this rectified. The blame lies on both Asian males & Asian females who have been brought up to put white beauty on a pedastal.

But in the future, I still expect Asian + Latino combinations to be the largest growing segment. Main reason being California, which has by far the largest Asian-American population (almost 50% of the ENTIRE Asian-American population lives in California alone). Pretty much now California is either Asian or Latino... full-blooded white people are becoming rare in California, mostly residing in either the Hollywood sector or the Silicon Valley sector.

I'd say your average Asian person in California meets more Latinos on a daily basis than whites (unless they live in one of those white posh neighborhoods like Beverely Hills or Malibu). So chances are, the Latino+Asian coupling will increase. Especially for Asian males. I mean, 2 of my best friends only like Latina girls and prefer them over white or Asian. Then again, both grew up in heavily-Latino areas (one is from Miami and the other West Side Chicago).

Again, this might be due to the racial ambiguity of Latina girls... at times, they can look just like a white girl (i.e. like an Italian girl), at times they can look Asian (like Filipino or Vietnamese), at times they can look mixed-black (like Mariah Carey). Heck, many Latinas can also look Native American due to the Amerindian blood.

[thmilin]

In the case of South America, there seems to be differing levels of "shades." But the general rule holds true in South America like it does anywhere else in the world: The "lighter" you are, the "higher" your status and the "darker" you are, the "lower" your status. You'll find this also holds true in the Middle East, in India, even in Africa... I still can't decide if this is more due to Western colonialism or an innate human tendency to prefer lighter skin-tones in humans. I think it's a bit of both actually.

As for the Asian + Black Hapa combination... of course they exist! Famous examples include Tiger Woods, former Super Bowl MVP Hines Ward, Naomi Campbell (who's more like 1/4 Hapa), etc. But out of the total Asian Hapa population, they still constitute a small although growing minority.

A majority of Asian Hapa combinations are still pretty much white + Asian. Again, I'd like to see this rectified. The blame lies on both Asian males & Asian females who have been brought up to put white beauty on a pedastal.

But in the future, I still expect Asian + Latino combinations to be the largest growing segment. Main reason being California, which has by far the largest Asian-American population (almost 50% of the ENTIRE Asian-American population lives in California alone). Pretty much now California is either Asian or Latino... full-blooded white people are becoming rare in California, mostly residing in either the Hollywood sector or the Silicon Valley sector.

I'd say your average Asian person in California meets more Latinos on a daily basis than whites (unless they live in one of those white posh neighborhoods like Beverely Hills or Malibu). So chances are, the Latino+Asian coupling will increase. Especially for Asian males. I mean, 2 of my best friends only like Latina girls and prefer them over white or Asian. Then again, both grew up in heavily-Latino areas (one is from Miami and the other West Side Chicago).

Again, this might be due to the racial ambiguity of Latina girls... at times, they can look just like a white girl (i.e. like an Italian girl), at times they can look Asian (like Filipino or Vietnamese), at times they can look mixed-black (like Mariah Carey). Heck, many Latinas can also look Native American due to the Amerindian blood.

i agree on the "levels of color" rule being wherever you go.i happen to think it's not about "prefering lighter" and that it's not all about the white man's colonization. the white man didn't necessarily make it into deepest china.

i think mankind has, like wolf packs and others in the animal kingdom, the requirement/need to establish dominance/superiority. visual markers are required. paleness being rarer than brownness can be seen as "pariah" or as "godlike, special." i don't think paleness began as a preference, i think it began as a unique visual identifier that was taken advantage of early, a kind of psychological race warfare. suspicion and primitive thinking had people accepting "fair skin must be pure, special, good, godly, better than me" and those of lighter skin were of course going to run around and scream the same to maintain their foothold.

but i'm not a historian, scientist, or researcher or anything.

oh, and i disagree about the black/asian white/asian thing. i seriously think our group is growing way more than people are aware. it USED to be rare. until i started to meet them multiple times a year.

what i am trying to say is, we are not unicorns. we are not just celebs and peeps you see on tv. i grew up and went to school with black/asian and white/asian hapa kids. of the hapa contingent at my school, 1/3 were black and asian.

since then, i've encountered way more and learned of way more than i used to see back then.

[takedown]

The biggest contributing factor to the so called IR dating disparity in America is still the Asian male's failure to take initiatives. Asian males usually don't want to seek out mates of other ethnic or racial groups. I think it's because they are not attracted to females of another race, it's more like they lack the self-confidence and open-mindedness.

Ok, b4 anyone rebukes me, I am an Asian male myself and I have to be honest that I notice these things about us.....

[RebelAzn]

The biggest contributing factor to the so called IR dating disparity in America is still the Asian male's failure to take initiatives. Asian males usually don't want to seek out mates of other ethnic or racial groups. I think it's because they are not attracted to females of another race, it's more like they lack the self-confidence and open-mindedness.

Ok, b4 anyone rebukes me, I am an Asian male myself and I have to be honest that I notice these things about us.....

I do agree to a certain extend. Part of it is our parents not promoting any kind of dating activities until we finish college. Part of it is due to lack of role models teaching Asian men the ropes of dating. Our parents think they are doing us a favor when in fact it is the reverse. Asian females are approached so their experiences are completely different than men who have to take the initiatives. My parents are like what I described. My older brother is like the more conservative Asian male. I was totally different. I started dating in high school and dated throughout college etc. Not surprisingly, both of my younger brothers also have dated a ton after me with all kinds of women. I guess having an older brother who paved the path has its advantages.

[RebelAzn]

In the case of South America, there seems to be differing levels of "shades." But the general rule holds true in South America like it does anywhere else in the world: The "lighter" you are, the "higher" your status and the "darker" you are, the "lower" your status. You'll find this also holds true in the Middle East, in India, even in Africa... I still can't decide if this is more due to Western colonialism or an innate human tendency to prefer lighter skin-tones in humans. I think it's a bit of both actually.

As for the Asian + Black Hapa combination... of course they exist! Famous examples include Tiger Woods, former Super Bowl MVP Hines Ward, Naomi Campbell (who's more like 1/4 Hapa), etc. But out of the total Asian Hapa population, they still constitute a small although growing minority.

A majority of Asian Hapa combinations are still pretty much white + Asian. Again, I'd like to see this rectified. The blame lies on both Asian males & Asian females who have been brought up to put white beauty on a pedastal.

But in the future, I still expect Asian + Latino combinations to be the largest growing segment. Main reason being California, which has by far the largest Asian-American population (almost 50% of the ENTIRE Asian-American population lives in California alone). Pretty much now California is either Asian or Latino... full-blooded white people are becoming rare in California, mostly residing in either the Hollywood sector or the Silicon Valley sector.

I'd say your average Asian person in California meets more Latinos on a daily basis than whites (unless they live in one of those white posh neighborhoods like Beverely Hills or Malibu). So chances are, the Latino+Asian coupling will increase. Especially for Asian males. I mean, 2 of my best friends only like Latina girls and prefer them over white or Asian. Then again, both grew up in heavily-Latino areas (one is from Miami and the other West Side Chicago).

Again, this might be due to the racial ambiguity of Latina girls... at times, they can look just like a white girl (i.e. like an Italian girl), at times they can look Asian (like Filipino or Vietnamese), at times they can look mixed-black (like Mariah Carey). Heck, many Latinas can also look Native American due to the Amerindian blood.


Do agree to a certain extend on the Asian Latino thing. However, I think CA is more or less now based on social class. I live here so I do see it. People tend to associate with people with similar social class. In this case, most Asians tend to hang with whites. Dating has to occur when people interact. I think Asians are interacting with Latinos, but not around where I live. Perhaps it is happening in schools, but I am just way too old to experience that right now. I do agree future is more about Latinos and Asians in CA. Latino culture is also similar to Asian culture in some ways.

I have dated a few Latino women. I was always their first Asian BF. Naturally they were surprised when I asked them out. Most told me they thought Asian men are only interested in Asian females and if they do date IR, it is with white women. So the perception that Asian men don't venture out is very true. When women regardless of color assume Asian men are not interested in them, they automatically eliminate Asian men from their dating pool. I personally think that's the biggest problem right there. Asian men just need to approach all women more period. We still live in a society where men usually have to approach women first.

[takedown]

a lil 2 cent on the latina phenomenon. I used to live in SoCal for a long time and I found some Latinas quite interested in Asian men. I used to holla at some....just never got to know them more. However, the main thing I notice is that Latino men do not (very much) like seeing latinas go out with other races. Because of this reason, they tend to be discouraged from dating men of other races - my observation. The whole Latino macho thing has its hold on their women. So sometimes I think we as Asian males are not doing enough - showing enough displeasure (outward, not inward) at our women dating outside (especially white guys).

[kimtae]

You're a mass of conflicting opinions and oversimplificatiions. In short, you're dumb.

[tokyolovestory]

a lil 2 cent on the latina phenomenon. I used to live in SoCal for a long time and I found some Latinas quite interested in Asian men. I used to holla at some....just never got to know them more. However, the main thing I notice is that Latino men do not (very much) like seeing latinas go out with other races. Because of this reason, they tend to be discouraged from dating men of other races - my observation. The whole Latino macho thing has its hold on their women. So sometimes I think we as Asian males are not doing enough - showing enough displeasure (outward, not inward) at our women dating outside (especially white guys).

Make up your mind. In the other thread you say the solution is for Asian men to just start dating out. Now you say Asian men should be more upset "outwardly" about Asian women dating out? What is your point? Kimtae is right--conflicting opinions and oversimplifications.

(By the way, I've been raised in SoCal and have had a small glimpse into Latino--mostly Mexican--culture. I don't think it's nearly as simplistic as you've made it sound by your "observation." I've had a number of conversations with a lot of people--in Spanish so there's less margin for error in regards to communication. "The whole Latino macho thing?" Please. :rolleyes: )

[awong]

a lil 2 cent on the latina phenomenon. I used to live in SoCal for a long time and I found some Latinas quite interested in Asian men. I used to holla at some....just never got to know them more. However, the main thing I notice is that Latino men do not (very much) like seeing latinas go out with other races. Because of this reason, they tend to be discouraged from dating men of other races - my observation. The whole Latino macho thing has its hold on their women. So sometimes I think we as Asian males are not doing enough - showing enough displeasure (outward, not inward) at our women dating outside (especially white guys).

generalchao, chenjuanito is that you?

[RebelAzn]

The IR dating disparity is merely symptoms of many other things that's going on within Asian American community. The real issue won't go away until we learn to appreciate who we are as unique human beings. The media, society and stereotypes play huge roles in the IR disparity today. Until those things change, it is up to individuals to find acceptance within themselves. Ultimately, the solution is about Asian men and women working together to solve this issue. If not, the same cycle will repeat itself over and over with next generation and so on.

I think before you can have a normal relationship with anyone, you need to be comfortable with who you are. If you are dating to hide your insecurities, it will only make your relationship worse in the long term.

[takedown]

Sup Tokyo,

I have made up my mind. I have made up my mind to be the best man out there for the ladies. Not just Asian ladies, but ALL ladies. When I said that maybe we should show displeasure towards Asian women dating out....well, showing displeasure does not mean demonizing them. Just like if your kid did something wrong you don't necessarily need to hit them but you can still show that you ain't down with what he/she did.

I don't have a problem with ppl dating outside their race. I just don't like it when ppl do it due to self-loathing. I am sure this is something we can all agree on. As far as you saying that this IR dating disparity is a bigger community problem. Ok, I get it. So what do you propose that we should do about it - if we were to do anything at all?

[tokyolovestory]

Sup Tokyo,

I have made up my mind. I have made up my mind to be the best man out there for the ladies. Not just Asian ladies, but ALL ladies. When I said that maybe we should show displeasure towards Asian women dating out....well, showing displeasure does not mean demonizing them. Just like if your kid did something wrong you don't necessarily need to hit them but you can still show that you ain't down with what he/she did.

I don't have a problem with ppl dating outside their race. I just don't like it when ppl do it due to self-loathing. I am sure this is something we can all agree on. As far as you saying that this IR dating disparity is a bigger community problem. Ok, I get it. So what do you propose that we should do about it - if we were to do anything at all?

You're stepping into shaky territory. Your wording is the stuff with which the Asian feminists/YT lovers have a serious problem. You're comparing the displeasing actions of (some) Asian women with the actions of children. So how do you suggest you show this displeasure?

Your second point is a large part of the problem in figuring out IRs. Since everyone who is in an IR will claim that theirs is the ONE exception--the ONE relationship not based on self-loathing or indoctrination into the Western hierarchy of race--you have nothing to go on but your OWN opinion regarding their relationship. Now, because my closest friends all only date within their own race, I have yet to see a good example of an IR that WASN'T based on some kind of preconceived notion of one regarding the other, or even the two, mutually.

As for what to do regarding the larger problem, we still have yet to build the type of power we need to change society in such a large way. Yes, we have to all do our own part to change our small part of the world. But in the end, it will take a far larger movement than what we can each do on our own to change the way the media portrays us, and particularly Asian men, the way PEOPLE think of us, etc. If you think about it, the fact that there are boards dedicated to those of Asian descent and others interested in our issues, and there are organizations for us, etc, should already indicate to you what is it people are *already* doing. It's way past the suggestion stage.

[takedown]

Tokyo,

Instead of answering your thread with more comments and explanations, let me just ask you a more personal question: are you attracted to females that are not Asian? Or maybe a more refined version of this question: Have there been females of other races you were attracted to?

[tokyolovestory]

Tokyo,

Instead of answering your thread with more comments and explanations, let me just ask you a more personal question: are you attracted to females that are not Asian? Or maybe a more refined version of this question: Have there been females of other races you were attracted to?

I am a woman, and I am heterosexual. While I have never been attracted to females of any race in that way, the majority of my female friends, overwhelmingly, are Asian. And while I have dated a few times outside of my race, it has never worked out for me--it lacks a certain connection. As time went on, I began to realize that what I saw as "attractive" in men of other races was often colored by what society said was attractive in those men. As I grew older, I found myself searching for something more than a conformity to what the rest of the world thought was a "good man." I have yet to find the mutual understanding, compassion, and general ability to connect that I find with the Asian men I have dated with men of any other race. (Also, Asian men are just plain HOT.)

At any rate, the answer to your question would be: in the past, yes. But at this stage in my life, I look to Asian men. Call me close-minded but I can see myself nowhere else.

[takedown]

sorry Tokyogirl,

For some reason I thought you were a man. Anyway, just took a look at your profile. You are extremely young and already has made up your mind on dating Asian men only (am I right?) - that's somewhat commendable. Ok, my next question would be: if you saw an Asian guy with say, a white girl, do you immediately have negative feelings toward them? Just curious.

[tokyolovestory]

What are the dynamics of their relationship? Is he talking smack about Asian girls to his white girlfriend (ex. elevating her status/worth as a girlfriend because of her race, relative to women of his own race)? Or is he a man who claims he supports the AA cause and declares Asian women sexy and appealing while dating a white girl? All these things come into play to indicate what type of CHARACTER the man has.

I have known too many Asian men who have placed white girls above Asian women on the "totem pole," making white women (it's usually white women, as opposed to black women, or Latinas) their pinnacle achievement in terms of a relationship. I have no respect for men like that, and will tell them as much. Likewise for the Asian women.

But when I see an Asian guy with a white girl? What do I care? Unless I know him to be a hypocrite or a hater, he means nothing to me. As I said, my closest friends date within the race.

Oh and...

"[S]omewhat commendable?" Don't patronize me.

[jaehwan]

Instead of answering your thread with more comments and explanations, let me just ask you a more personal question: are you attracted to females that are not Asian? Or maybe a more refined version of this question: Have there been females of other races you were attracted to?


For some reason I thought you were a man.

takedown,

If it makes you feel any better, a guy who called himself "tokyolovestory" probably wouldn't be interested in females anyway.

[takedown]

isn't tokyolovestory some movie ...? anyway, it'd b nice if more ppl joined in on this thread. This site is kinda dead ya?

[nskripchun]

isn't tokyolovestory some movie ...? anyway, it'd b nice if more ppl joined in on this thread. This site is kinda dead ya?

Not to sound too harsh takedown, but it's more like this issue has been discussed several times, and so far, nothing new has been brought up in this thread.

Check out out some of the front page content here:

http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/category/blog/sex-relationships/

I recommend these articles by Dialectic as a good starting point:

http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2007/07/18/inter-racial-dating-by-asian-americans/

http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2007/07/20/emily-sue-has-brown-eyes-race-fetish-and-love/

[takedown]

oh well, i guess you are right.

Maybe we should just start to talk about hot chics!!!

[Makulita]

Suprisingly enough... we've done that shit too.

[kimtae]

Actually, intelligent discussion would be welcome on any topic whether it's been broached or not but some random dummy coming here out of the blue to tell us all how it is with his broadstroke platitudes just doesn't get people excited the way it used to.

[nightshade]

Let's resume taking about hot boys.

[thmilin]

As time went on, I began to realize that what I saw as "attractive" in men of other races was often colored by what society said was attractive in those men. As I grew older, I found myself searching for something more than a conformity to what the rest of the world thought was a "good man." I have yet to find the mutual understanding, compassion, and general ability to connect that I find with the Asian men I have dated with men of any other race. (Also, Asian men are just plain HOT.)

At any rate, the answer to your question would be: in the past, yes. But at this stage in my life, I look to Asian men. Call me close-minded but I can see myself nowhere else.

All of this is well and good as long as:

- you realize what you see as "not attractive" in men of other races was often colored by what society (whichever societal group it might be) said was not attractive in those men.

also, that you realize what you see as "attractive" in Asian men can be as equally colored by society as what you state you saw as "attractive" in other races of men.

example: if your parents or community raised you to believe all Asian men are responsible, hard working, super smart, ethical individuals ... you tied your own stereotypes, defined them as positives to look for in a man, and assumed they occurred in Asian men, and therefore when you encountered it in an Asian man, felt that indeed, you, and your community, were right.

boil it down to: the brainwashing you feel you underwent can apply both ways. it doesn't make it any more valid or better or different if the brainwashing "works" for your own ethnicity.

i think my problem here is your reasons for "waking up" re: "what society told you was attractive."

that feels like a copout to me. are you telling me you dated men of other ethnicities for all the wrong reasons, felt no love, attraction, desire, nor saw anything worthy in them to date, and you later "woke up" and realized you had it all wrong and you were only going to find something worthy in Asian males?

that's bull shit. fine, date your own race, but call a spade a spade. you can't say on the one hand you don't care if you see a white girl with an asian dude or vice versa but then also say you saw the light and saw the only good things you see worth being with exist in Asian males.

to quote you - you have YET to see.

assuming you will NEVER see or probably WON'T see is further allowing your views to be "colored" and picking and choosing when and how to apply stereotypes about race and human beings.

are you sure when you say you're searching for more than conformity - white conformity, I assume - and "chose your own race" that you weren't just choosing another form of conformity?

if you make a choice of ONE, that's fine, it's your choice. but again - own it. you're being flippant re: "being close-minded." it's not just that. you are being selectively exclusionary based on ethnicity towards non-Asian males, which is just another form of very polite, generally forgiven, and understood by ethnic groups, but nonetheless - racism.

i will underscore this to say i am arguing through your reasoning and logic, provided here. don't know you, don't claim to, don't think i have you figured out. just addressing your points, and how you laid them out, and my disagreement with your argument/justification for your choice.

[tokyolovestory]

Oh Jesus, on my way to work, don't have time. Will reply later, I'm probably wasting my time.

[nottyboy]

However, the main thing I notice is that Latino men do not (very much) like seeing latinas go out with other races. Because of this reason, they tend to be discouraged from dating men of other races - my observation. The whole Latino macho thing has its hold on their women. So sometimes I think we as Asian males are not doing enough - showing enough displeasure (outward, not inward) at our women dating outside (especially white guys).

It's more complex than that, because it varies among Latino groups. I will say that among the groups that feel this way, this sort of attitude is almost always directed towards black people. Beyond that kind of bigotry, though, I have never seen controversy over interracial dating in the Latin community; not the way you see it in the Black and Asian communities.

If most Latinas are not dating interracially it's probably because they don't want to, or they're not being asked. The notion that Latin men have that much power over the dating choices of Latinas as a whole is a stretch, IMHO. I'm open to being corrected though.

[jaehwan]

boil it down to: the brainwashing you feel you underwent can apply both ways.

If you ever feel like cracking open a book, check out "Orientalism" by Edward Said.

[takedown]

nottyboy,

I agree with you that a lot of the resentment of latin men r towards black men when it comes to latin women dating other races. Actually, this sort of ties in with all the gang violence and sh*t between black and brown - at least in parts of SoCal. Apparently a lot of black men try to pick up latinas. I asked a Mexican friend of mine once why some latinas go with blacks, he said that the girls tend to like the dark skin.... dunno if that's entirely accurate.

From my true experiences in SoCal, I found that in general latin (mostly Mexican) women are the friendliest to me in the social scene (clubs and bars, etc...) And when I say this, I mean they are even friendlier than the Asian girls (don't know why this is true either). I personally knew a Mexican girl who was interested in an Asian guy - unfortunately that guy was somebody else, not me. Anyway, my point is that I think a lot of them do want to date outside their race (get with Asian guys) but due to peer pressure they eventually don't. Just like Asian guys, maybe a lot of us want to be with a girl with another race, but our family and our friends discourage us from doing so...therefore we eventually just get with our own.

[maogirl]

I'm probably wasting my time.

no truer words were typed out.

[nottyboy]

nottyboy,

I agree with you that a lot of the resentment of latin men r towards black men when it comes to latin women dating other races. Actually, this sort of ties in with all the gang violence and sh*t between black and brown - at least in parts of SoCal. Apparently a lot of black men try to pick up latinas. I asked a Mexican friend of mine once why some latinas go with blacks, he said that the girls tend to like the dark skin.... dunno if that's entirely accurate.


It depends on which latin men you're talking about. What may apply to, say, Mexican and Argentinian men, may not apply to Dominicans, and Cubans. For example, I wouldn't say Dominicans generally resent when a black dude dates a Dominican girl. I'm not that familiar with real Mexican or Chicano culture, so I can't say. I'm not trying to say there is no racism in Latin culture everywhere, though.

Gangs complicate things too. If a girl is in a gang, it's highly unlikely that they'll be "allowed" to be with anyone outside the gang. They literally belong to the gang, in my undestanding.

nottyboy,From my true experiences in SoCal, I found that in general latin (mostly Mexican) women are the friendliest to me in the social scene (clubs and bars, etc...) And when I say this, I mean they are even friendlier than the Asian girls (don't know why this is true either). I personally knew a Mexican girl who was interested in an Asian guy - unfortunately that guy was somebody else, not me. Anyway, my point is that I think a lot of them do want to date outside their race (get with Asian guys) but due to peer pressure they eventually don't. Just like Asian guys, maybe a lot of us want to be with a girl with another race, but our family and our friends discourage us from doing so...therefore we eventually just get with our own.

I can't discount your experience, but I'm still having a hard time seeing how Latin guys as a whole are heavily influencing or controlling Latinas. How exactly are they doing that? Are we talking about old-school families where the father/brother will give you a beat down? Friends making fun of them?

I mean, honestly, whenever I've heard or seen resistance to dating Asian guys is because of stereotypes about manliness, standards of beauty, etc. That's not coming from Latin guys, IMHO.

[takedown]

For us (Asians) apparently it has become so common for an Asian girl to date outside her race that Asian ppl in general don't care no more. This is the sentiment I get. I am not saying that the main cause of Asian girls dating out interracially is due to Asian men's apathy towards it, but the general apathy (or the lack of disapproval) that Asian men have towards this issue has, in my opinion, reinforced the phenomenon of Asian girls dating outside their race. This is just how I feel.

Now, I am not saying whether the men of a race should or should not discourage their women from dating outside their race (that varies from person to person). However, I think peer pressure (which is a sociological thang) does have an effect on ppl in a group. When I say peer pressure, I mean in the broad sense: members in you group could directly give you hints to not do something, or you would not do something just because you are afraid that you will lose something you have with your group if you ventured out. So in conclusion, I dunno how many latino men are actually telling their women to not date out. But a lot of latin ladies won't do so anyway just because they don't wanna lose their connection to their latin community by dating out.

In fact, there are Asian women who date exclusively Asian because they want to remain in the "Asian bubble". I know a lot of girls like that. I am supposing that the same thing happens in other cultures. Sorry, MOST OF US (humans) don't really have a pure individual mind. However, apparently the Asian bubble isn't that big or strong - which makes me really wonder about the strength of our culture here in the states... (more discussion on this is welcome)

[tokyolovestory]

For us (Asians) apparently it has become so common for an Asian girl to date outside her race that Asian ppl in general don't care no more. This is the sentiment I get.

Are you serious? You think Asian people don't care? Now, first, let's talk about whether you're talking about IRs in general, or the most common IR couple (i.e. WM/AF). There may be different levels of how "accepted" each different type of IR is, but I don't think there's any "not caring" going on. That's the whole reason why you see threads like this... right?

And thmilin:

You are more wrong than you could POSSIBLY imagine about me--and all that BS about how you're not assuming you know anything blah blah... Yeah, right. But I'm not going to get into all the ways you are wrong, because it's a waste of time and I've had a long day.

[takedown]

Are you serious? You think Asian people don't care? Now, first, let's talk about whether you're talking about IRs in general, or the most common IR couple (i.e. WM/AF). There may be different levels of how "accepted" each different type of IR is, but I don't think there's any "not caring" going on. That's the whole reason why you see threads like this... right?

Well, it is my personal opinion (based on my life experience) that Asian ppl are the most accepting of dating white ppl out of all other minorities. When I say accepting I mean not necessarily in a good way. In particular, I don't really see too many Asian men doing anything constructive to curb the trend of AF/WM - if that's what they dislike (since they are the ones who seem to complain about it the most). I hear mostly whining and verbal complaints amongst Asian men themselves. The way I see it, if you think somebody is taking "your women" in large numbers and you don't like it, you should either take that sh*t back or jack some o' their women too. Excuse my language. But it's that simple. Be a man about it - I am sayin' this sh*t right now and I am Asian.

You don't think there's no "not-caring" going on. How exactly is this shown amongst our ppls?

[RebelAzn]

Well, it is my personal opinion (based on my life experience) that Asian ppl are the most accepting of dating white ppl out of all other minorities. When I say accepting I mean not necessarily in a good way.

You obviously don't know many Chinese people. There are families who disowned their kids for dating white people. You need to get out often. While acceptance is vary among different Asian groups, most Chinese and Korean families I know are not exactly looking forward to their kids hooking up with white people. Some other Asian families might be more accepting but you can't say everyone is the same.


In particular, I don't really see too many Asian men doing anything constructive to curb the trend of AF/WM - if that's what they dislike (since they are the ones who seem to complain about it the most). I hear mostly whining and verbal complaints amongst Asian men themselves. The way I see it, if you think somebody is taking "your women" in large numbers and you don't like it, you should either take that sh*t back or jack some o' their women too. Excuse my language. But it's that simple. Be a man about it - I am sayin' this sh*t right now and I am Asian.

You don't think there's no "not-caring" going on. How exactly is this shown amongst our ppls?


What the hell are you talking about? How old are you anyway? Nobody owns any girl. Each woman can do whatever she wants. The problem is some Asian women in IRs are not dating people just people, they are dating for status and white acceptance. I really think your approach to this thing is all wrong. I think if people just date whoever they like regardless of the color, we would have less issues. The problem within Asian American community is we are so spread out that many feel the need to assimilate into the white culture to be accepted. Let me ask you this, what have you done to solve the IR problem? It is not exactly a simple issue to solve when there are many split groups of Asians and many Asians are not exactly banding together to solve social issues.

[nottyboy]

For us (Asians) apparently it has become so common for an Asian girl to date outside her race that Asian ppl in general don't care no more. This is the sentiment I get. I am not saying that the main cause of Asian girls dating out interracially is due to Asian men's apathy towards it, but the general apathy (or the lack of disapproval) that Asian men have towards this issue has, in my opinion, reinforced the phenomenon of Asian girls dating outside their race. This is just how I feel.


Like the other posters pointed out, it doesn't seem that way. I'm only going from what I've seen on one site or two like this one, but the subject's come up even on dumb forums like the Myspace dating boards. I've yet to have an Asian friend bring it up in conversation though...but why would they anyway.

Now, I am not saying whether the men of a race should or should not discourage their women from dating outside their race (that varies from person to person). However, I think peer pressure (which is a sociological thang) does have an effect on ppl in a group. When I say peer pressure, I mean in the broad sense: members in you group could directly give you hints to not do something, or you would not do something just because you are afraid that you will lose something you have with your group if you ventured out. So in conclusion, I dunno how many latino men are actually telling their women to not date out. But a lot of latin ladies won't do so anyway just because they don't wanna lose their connection to their latin community by dating out.


I've yet to see anyone give hints or what not, honestly. If anything, the ones that have talked shit to me about dating non-Latinas have been Latinas themselves, and even that has been rare. :) In my experience, most Latinas just seem to be way into their culture, with black culture being very very close, at least for those who are of Caribbean ancestry.

Like I said before, though, I can't speak for what happens on the West Coast or [in] other Latin subcultures. I can say that for the most part, Puerto Ricans and Dominicans, maybe Cubans, are actually pretty accepting of others, because we're already so mixed. Upper class people can be a different story, though.

In fact, there are Asian women who date exclusively Asian because they want to remain in the "Asian bubble". I know a lot of girls like that. I am supposing that the same thing happens in other cultures. Sorry, MOST OF US (humans) don't really have a pure individual mind. However, apparently the Asian bubble isn't that big or strong - which makes me really wonder about the strength of our culture here in the states... (more discussion on this is welcome)

I think that "bubble" of sorts exists regardless of culture. I believe other things come into play too, like what generation we're talking about, and how far a group has assimilated (or been allowed to assimilate). I have to admit my lack of formal knowledge on how this works, though.

Edit: Ack, I typed that whole novel only to find out you got banned.

[RebelAzn]

While there are many other reasons, one the reasons I know for sure is Asian men just don't approach non-Asian females period in real life. I have spoke to quite a few white females that were actually specifically interested in Asian men and they have told me the same. I mean these are not ugly chicks. They are educated and they are good women that make good potential mating partners. Several of those were actually actively seeking out Asian males but Asian males just don't approach them. They actually met their boyfriends online because they told me that's the only place where Asian males approach them.

In a society where men still have to approach women first, this is a tough nut to crack. Seriously, some of the guys out there need to go pursue women if they want dates and that include going after Asian women too. I really believe there are number of non-Asian females are interested if guys are actually pursuing them. If a girl wants certain guy and the guy never talks to her, at some point she will give up and date whoever ends up asking her out. For women it is easier cause they don't have to do the asking. I think this is one of the reasons for the IR disparity.

[uRB4N]

I knew that Asian women date and marry outside their race much more often then men but I hardly knew it was so rampant before coming onto these boards.

[elliott20]

well, add another one to the balancing scale cuz I just tied the knot with my girlfriend no more than 2 weeks ago. (Who is in fact, white)

[Synthetic]

well, add another one to the balancing scale cuz I just tied the knot with my girlfriend no more than 2 weeks ago. (Who is in fact, white)

marrying a white woman?!?! you're such a sellout, man!!! haha.

[NICENURSE]

I'm not going into #1 (cause we've had too many discussions about it on this board), but in terms of #2, I actually think in the long-term the USA and the world is moving towards a multi-racial society (like South America). I mean, in the States, 1/3 of the people are racial minorities and by 2050 whites will be less than 50% of the US population.

As for Asians in America, all the hapa kids they're pumping out will be the future face of Asian-America. A lot of future hapa's will go through that identity crisis (i.e. Not White enough for Whites, yet not Asian enough to use chopsticks). I also think there'll be more diversity from Hapa kids than the typical Asian/White combination we see now.

I think intermarriages between Asian and Latinos will increase in the States. Both groups are a demographic time bomb waiting to happen. #1. Latino males can look quite white, which would be appealing to Asian chicks #2. For Asian guys, I think Latina females are generally more open-minded about dating different races than your typical white chick or Asian chick. Not to mention the general hotness of Latina girls: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1103/heyyu/Paula%20Garces/john_cho19.jpg

BLACK GIRLS ARE HOT TOO.

[thmilin]

If you ever feel like cracking open a book, check out "Orientalism" by Edward Said.

ok, i've added it to my wishlist. i hope that you don't mean that in a belittling way, cuz i'm not trying to discount the brainwashing statement of tokyolovestory.

i'm saying if there was an outside influence she experienced that caused her to date outside of her ethnicity alone - then there was an outside influence that caused her to date ONLY inside of her ethnicity.

[thmilin]

And thmilin:

You are more wrong than you could POSSIBLY imagine about me--and all that BS about how you're not assuming you know anything blah blah... Yeah, right. But I'm not going to get into all the ways you are wrong, because it's a waste of time and I've had a long day.

how is it BS if all i know about you is from that post? what do you expect people to do, take your words at face value? oh, that's what i did, sue me.

you yourself made the comment about being close-minded and not caring. i'm calling you on it. there are different ways to apply racism, different aspects to discriminating against others.

i don't even disagree with you about your experiences.

if you did not find what you were seeking when you dated other ethnicities, fine.

if you have found what you are seeking when you date ONLY your ethnicity, fine.

if you deliberately do not date other ethnicities because you believe they could never offer the same qualities in a man in one package that you have found in men of your own ethnicity - not fine.

if you were pressured to conform by broad society and dated other men, can you not be open to the possibility that you might have been pressured by OTHER members of society to date only men of your ethnicity?

HOWEVER ... let's say you're taiwanese. let's say you have only ever felt a true connection with other taiwanese. let's say you dated all colors of the rainbow, and still in the end felt no other man understood what it was to be taiwanese, and therefore understood you in a way you needed and wanted to be understood - other than a taiwanese male. he understands your upbringing, your culture, your identity as taiwanese.

THAT's fine. if that's what you were trying to say, i get it, but you sure did come off as saying you'll never find all the qualities worth loving present in a man outside your own group, and i think my response was a legitimate call on what you said.

[JadeDragon]

thmilin, you're being unnecessarily hostile, and while you accuse others of not wanting to learn and being close-minded, you're guilty of the same thing. I've read through your posts and they show that you only want certain responses to your questions and statements, which defeats the purpose of coming here for dialogue, to put it lightly. This is your first warning.

[uRB4N]

I don't think it's a bad thing if Asians don't give a shit what white people think honestly. You're talking about a group of people who managed to oppress people of color for hundreds of years and then they feel they can just patch things up on their own terms?

Screw that noise.

[evil_FUX]

First, not really jumping on the bandwagon here. Second, thmilin while I understand you likely have good intentions behind your posts in this discussion, I looked back at your most recent post and the one that TLS responded, and to me it looks like you're reading way too much into TLS's statements. Her last post is referring to the general idea you made about it in your last post.

[tokyolovestory]

Alright, you know what, I think I've been pretty patient until now. But this is beginning to get on my nerves.

Even in the first post over which you threw a little butt-hurt hissy fit, I didn't say "the only reason I dated men of other races was because society told me to." If you go back and read, I said:

As time went on, I began to realize that what I saw as "attractive" in men of other races was often colored by what society said was attractive in those men.

Though obviously, you ignored that to try to paint me into a corner regarding what I said because I am so obviously racist. Please.

I hate sharing any part of my life story with people on the internet, but you're obviously going to cry about it until you get some kind of justification for or against the idea of me you've created inside your own head.

I have dated two Caucasian men so far in my life. Neither turned out well. The first, after we broke up, went off on a rant about how his older brother had "always told him Asian girl were sluts." (WTF?) The second one had the nerve to tell me, "You're lucky you're dating a white guy. Oh and wear makeup when we go out. I want to be seen with a pretty girl." Since then, every white man who has approached me has been a) disrespectful b) overbearing c) creepy. Which are possible in men of EVERY RACE, it just happened to be present in the Caucasian men who tried to come up on me, which immediately made the answer, "No."

I've had bad experiences with Asian men too, believe me. I am Japanese and I have dated ONE Japanese man in my life so far. He cheated on me with a white girl, and after we broke up, would still get mad when guys would walk up to me. Delusional much? But I have to say that Japanese men generally will not approach me because apparently, as I'm always told, I look Korean.

And as for how the reasons why I find Asian men attractive could be my own community's brainwashing... That might work if I had only dated one kind of Asian guy. However my dating experiences with Asian men have spanned the whole spectrum. Anywhere from the 4.0 GPA, went to church three times a week, etc... all the way to battle-scarred, fighting was his weekend hobby, used to chill with the vatos kind of guy. (Vatos, ie the whole Nortenos and Surenos thing we have going on in California.) So how am I brainwashed?

you can't say on the one hand you don't care if you see a white girl with an asian dude or vice versa but then also say you saw the light and saw the only good things you see worth being with exist in Asian males.

First of all, I didn't say I only see good things in Asian men. But even if I did, why would it then automatically make it impossible for me to not care if I see an Asian man with a white girl? That's his choice. And no matter how much I kick and scream, I'm not going to change his mind. He has to be the one to do that.

...

Why am I even trying? This is going to get me nowhere and I have just wasted several minutes of my life.

(Sorry Jade, I'm not trying to be hostile or anything, I just resent it when people try to set me up for stupid BS.)

[RebelAzn]

The second one had the nerve to tell me, "You're lucky you're dating a white guy. Oh and wear makeup when we go out. I want to be seen with a pretty girl."

Are you serious? Do Asian women really put up with this crap with these losers?

It reminds me the other day when I was channel surfing and I saw the new show "The Moment of the Truth". Anyway, it had a white guy on it and he has an Hapa girlfriend. The guy is a waiter in Hermosa Beach. Here is what he admitted to:

1) He has taken other waiters' tips
2) He has done multiple things he is ashamed of in Marine corp.
3) He drove drunk a number of times
4) He makes fun of his girlfriend's ethnicity behind her back. His girlfriend is half Japanese half white.
5) He has sent multiple flirtatious text messages to other women while dating her. (His gf has no knowledge of this)
6) He has used the excuse he has no money (he has none) not to propose to his girlfriend.
7) He has changed the customer bill in order to try to get more tips as a waiter.
8) He said his girlfriend is boring.

Oh yeah, he is suppose to be an underwear model. You know which question that caught him lying after he already earned $10K?

1) Did you stuff your underwear while you were modeling?

He said no and he was caught lying. He ended up with $0 or nothing. The whole audience was busting out laughing. Granted his girlfriend was no looker, but what kind of woman would date a loser like this? Apparently some would cause his girlfriend actually gave him a hug at end of the show. Man do some of these women need some self esteem.

[krnbboyprd]

Come on RebelAzn not all men are up front and truthful. Sometimes you are in a relationship and you finally then find out what their true colors are really like. Yeah I am sure women can date some losers but on the flip so can men. Like it said he made fun of her behind her back, how the hell does she know this..You know guys can be all sweet and nice but in reality they are assholes...

In this case this guy sounds like a winner..

[RebelAzn]

Come on RebelAzn not all men are up front and truthful. Sometimes you are in a relationship and you finally then find out what their true colors are really like. Yeah I am sure women can date some losers but on the flip so can men. Like it said he made fun of her behind her back, how the hell does she know this..You know guys can be all sweet and nice but in reality they are assholes...

In this case this guy sounds like a winner..

Speaking for yourself dude. Not all the guys are assholes like you described.

[krnbboyprd]

I never said all guys I said they can be. I'm sure their are many that are Great but a lot can be assholes. What I don't get is why are you getting upset with me when your making a stupid comment. It sounds like your putting the blame on just the women saying that they need more self esteem.

What your not understanding is that a lot of men lie about who they are. Most of the time the truth comes out when they are in a relationship. I really don't care of you agree with me or not because a lot of cases you hear the guy being the asshole instead of the women.

I am getting the impression that it is the girls fault for dating a jerk or they have a low self esteem. Don't you think that the person she is with may have mislead her or lied. I feel that you are sating that TLS has a low self esteem and your statement was meant indirectly for her.

[RebelAzn]

I never said all guys I said they can be. I'm sure their are many that are Great but a lot can be assholes. What I don't get is why are you getting upset with me when your making a stupid comment. It sounds like your putting the blame on just the women saying that they need more self esteem.

What your not understanding is that a lot of men lie about who they are. Most of the time the truth comes out when they are in a relationship. I really don't care of you agree with me or not because a lot of cases you hear the guy being the asshole instead of the women.

I am getting the impression that it is the girls fault for dating a jerk or they have a low self esteem. Don't you think that the person she is with may have mislead her or lied. I feel that you are sating that TLS has a low self esteem and your statement was meant indirectly for her.

Sure a lot of men can be assholes. What's your point? Women that don't have low self esteem don't stick around with losers like the one I saw on the game show. TLS obviously ditched the guy so that does speak volume about her.

In your last post you stated the guy is a winner, what do you mean by this? What I described is considered a winner to you?

[jaehwan]

ok, i've added it to my wishlist. i hope that you don't mean that in a belittling way, cuz i'm not trying to discount the brainwashing statement of tokyolovestory.

i'm saying if there was an outside influence she experienced that caused her to date outside of her ethnicity alone - then there was an outside influence that caused her to date ONLY inside of her ethnicity.

Read the book. Seriously. It'll provide some background on the asymmetrical nature of colonization where there simply isn't an "equal and opposite reaction."
When one race holds so many of the cards, the opposite influence that you describe either doesn't exist or doesn't exist in as potent a form.

[maogirl]

Are you serious? Do Asian women really put up with this crap with these losers?


for fuck's sake, like asian men DON'T??

a few years ago, i was at a wedding and talking to some asian american dude and his white gf. the guy asked me if my boyfriend was chinese, and when i said yes, his gf said, "oh, he must have a small penis, then." and her bf laughed along with her.

seriously, what is up with some of the posters in this forum? you act like only asian chicks have a colonized mindset when the men are obviously just as retarded.

look at idiot20. i'm actually glad he's marrying an old white bitch, he can remove his retarded genes from the asian pool.


anyway, i jsut wanted to say, i was right about thimilin from the start. but then, i'm usually right and no one cares...sigh. time to look at more edison porn.

[tokyolovestory]

Yeah, tell me about it. I've known a number of Asian American guys who'll lick their white girlfriend's shoes just to be able to walk around the mall with her and hold her damn purse. It's sad, really.

lol MG, I totally felt you on thmilin. I knew it was gonna be a waste of time, but my temper gets the best of me at times and I just can't let it slide. Blame it on the temperament of the young and foolish, oh wise one. haha

[krnbboyprd]

I was being sarcastic...

[RebelAzn]

a few years ago, i was at a wedding and talking to some asian american dude and his white gf. the guy asked me if my boyfriend was chinese, and when i said yes, his gf said, "oh, he must have a small penis, then." and her bf laughed along with her.



What did you say to her? I had a white guy once who made fun of Asian penis in front of me. I told him why don't we whip it out and measure it in front of everyone. You should see the look on the guy's face. He chickened out.

A black guy did the same once. I told him a man's intelligence is directly proportional to his dick size. Suddenly it wasn't so funny anymore.

Men who are fixated with other men's dick sizes are usually a) gay b) have little dicks themselves. c) very insecure about their own dicks one way or another.

[RebelAzn]

Yeah, tell me about it. I've known a number of Asian American guys who'll lick their white girlfriend's shoes just to be able to walk around the mall with her and hold her damn purse. It's sad, really.


Well I have known a number of Asian men who aren't like that. Frankly, when I had choices, I always choose the woman whom I have the most compatibility. In most cases, it is the Asian woman. I like women who are proud of who they are and have a ton of confidence. A total low self esteem white-washed woman without a real identity is definitely a huge turn off.

[maogirl]

What did you say to her? I had a white guy once who made fun of Asian penis in front of me. I told him why don't we whip it out and measure it in front of everyone. You should see the look on the guy's face. He chickened out.

A black guy did the same once. I told him a man's intelligence is directly proportional to his dick size. Suddenly it wasn't so funny anymore.

Men who are fixated with other men's dick sizes are usually a) gay b) have little dicks themselves. c) very insecure about their own dicks one way or another.

sigh, why are you so retarded?

the point of my post was to illustrate that asian men are just as capable as asian women are of accepting bullshit from white people.

instead you go straight to the "OMG did you defend asian penis!!!" for someone who claims that men who are fixated on other penises are insecure, you're pretty quick to ask what i replied and to put up your own anecdotes.

hm...!

aren't you older than i am? this is just fucking sad.

Well I have known a number of Asian men who aren't like that. Frankly, when I had choices, I always choose the woman whom I have the most compatibility. In most cases, it is the Asian woman. I like women who are proud of who they are and have a ton of confidence. A total low self esteem white-washed woman without a real identity is definitely a huge turn off.

well, i know a number of asian men who are like that.

oh my god! what now????????? will the universe explode from this paradox?? where's stephen hawking when you need him!??

[RebelAzn]

sigh, why are you so retarded?

the point of my post was to illustrate that asian men are just as capable as asian women are of accepting bullshit from white people.

instead you go straight to the "OMG did you defend asian penis!!!" for someone who claims that men who are fixated on other penises are insecure, you're pretty quick to ask what i replied and to put up your own anecdotes.




Based on your posts, I thought you might have said something funny and might want to share. Anyway, I did address the Asian men thing based in the 2nd post. When I read your post being someone made the statement in public, I simply recalled a couple of incidents I have encountered myself. What's with the hostility?

[uRB4N]

Asian women were never placed in second for me. In fact, I've always placed them in first place by a huge margin. Unfortunately, I grew up in a really white area and I had no real choice other than to date white girls. Of the 5 Asian girls there, 2 were unattractive and the other 3 belonged in the "Asian guys are ugly so I only date white guys" crowd. I'm sure every Asian guy has bumped into one of these at some point in their lives.

After moving to NYC, I've been pretty dismayed that almost every single Asian woman I see here is with a white guy. It's not even 50 percent, it's like 90%. I'm obviously excluding the tourists. Naturally, I think it has taken a toll on my self esteem. I'm a pretty well-to-do and confident guy but I think this issue has started to dent my confidence. If this issue bothers you that much, don't move here.

I'm currently casually dating a white girl from Jersey. Nothing serious. I don't think it's a excuse because I've pretty much gone out of my way to find a great Asian girl but has been blocked at almost every path.

Still, I hold no ill will like many Asian guys I've met nor have I given up hope.

Back on topic, I can echo what the women (Maogirl and Tokyo) have been saying. Many of my Asian male friends ask me why I'm so emo that I can't date Asian women when white women find me attractive. Granted, it doesn't happen as often as Asian women who worship white men but it does happen. Just at the other day at a friend's BBQ, many of the guys there seemed to treat the girl I've been seeing very well. So well in fact that the other Asian women there got pissed off.

My point being that it works both ways. Hopefully one day, Asian women and men will place each other as their top pick by a huge majority. Maybe in about 20-30 years from now.

[evil_FUX]

In not so much of an attempt to derail this thread even further, your description of your buddies, urban, totally remined me of the blip below. So sad and yet so funny.

[uRB4N]

Oh, no. I agree with you.

Once, upon finding out the girl I was seeing was white, one of them said "Alright! Awesome! high five!"

However, I think this type of behavior has been made worse because of the interracial dating habit of Asian women. whatever affects Asian women affects Asian men but they many fail to realize that.

Instead, many Asian women get defensive and pull the "me me me" angle. when you're involved in racial politics, "me" is replaced with "we." As racial minorities, we're involved by default.

[tokyolovestory]

One of the more irritating facets of this whole issue I've come across, though, (and I think this is in direct relation to maogirl's point that many--not all!--Asian-American men have become really sensitized because of the disparity) is that when I first meet some Asian-American men, they immediately assume I must be a CCB. Even if they know my friends and know they're pretty much all Asian, etc... I still have to spend the first half of the "getting to know them" time proving that I'm not going to suddenly run off on them the minute I see a white man. Not even getting to know them in a romantic way. Just as friends.

Now, I totally understand because it seems like there're 20 CCBs for every "real" Asian-American girl. But still! Gimme some credit, please!

[/rant]

[uRB4N]

I honestly don't think you can blame them. If that's all you encounter, you'll eventually be very defensive. Sure, it's stereotyping but if you get mugged multiple times by black men, you'll cross the street when you see a black man walking towards you.

To be honest though, I actually think Asian men are doing pretty good and are taking the whole situation quite well given the circumstances. Had it been black or white men in our position, cities would be on fire due to the mass rioting. Then again, the general apathy of Asian men might be why this issue has been dragging on for so long.

It reminds me of how white people say that since a joke or stereotype was perpetuated by a minority of the same group, it's ok. The example of that racist superbowl ad is a perfect example. I think that since many Asian men don't care or even defend it, is what gives Asian women the idea of "hey, blah blah is an Asian guy or my brother doesn't care" so Asian men must not mind!

[tokyolovestory]

It reminds me of how white people say that since a joke or stereotype was perpetuated by a minority of the same group, it's ok.

Okay, I agree, that drives me nuts. I hate it when people expect me to be okay with whatever ignorant BS they spout because some fool they knew at some point or another in their lives was "totally okay with it." Ugh.

I also agree that Asian-American women can be fools when it comes to the dating situation, and just generally the Asian-American male's issues. Many don't understand that it's all going to come back around full-circle, which is why I have an intense dislike for a lot of these idiot girls you see running around.

However, I also don't think there's ever a good reason to become trigger-happy with issues. If an Asian-American man approaches me and I reject him, I'm really pissed if he immediately turns around and calls me a sell-out. And eventually, it'll become a self-fulfilling prophecy; if he comes into every situation with a bad attitude thinking every Asian-American woman he meets will be a CCB, she'll reject him and then he'll throw himself another pity-party saying, "See, I was right, she WAS a CCB!" You know what I'm saying?

[uRB4N]

Oh, no. I hear you. That's absolutely correct.

I've been saying this time and time again that the whole interracial dating issue has been a sore spot for a long time but all Asian Americans do is sweep the issue under the rug.

It's caused by several factors but the one you're talking about is the "animosity aspect."

In short, Asian women date and marry out at very high rates which pisses off Asian men and puts in a huge dent in their confidence. This causes a lot of anger towards Asian women (ironically, the usual victims are the ones that prefer or only date Asian men) and puts insecurity on full display which turns Asian women off. No surprise, this forces them to turn to white men which leads to more animosity. The whole situation has turned into one huge circle jerk.

The larger the gap grows, the more animosity is going to grow. The more the gap decreases, the less animosity is going to be present. It's all about balance. The yin and yang, if you will. When you don't have balance in nature, you have conflict. It's no different here. I mean, it's in the South Korean flag for crying out loud. I was explaining this to a friend of mine and it was like I was explaining something revolutionary. I was shocked that it took such an explanation for her to finally realize what's going on and why it continues.

I think the interracial dating issue among Asian women is a huge issue for the Asian American community as a whole but it gets drowned out as being a topic strictly for bitter Asian men. It's surprising because we, as minorities, knows what it's like to have our concerns trivialized. It happens to black people when their concerns are dismissed as "race-baiting" or coming from an "Angry Black Man." Question is, why are we so quick to do it to our own?

Today, my boss was explaining how so many people believe that when a certain activity happens, it happens in a bubble where nothing else comes into play. The interracial dating issue is no different. So many Asians think that it's perfectly fine because it only involves two people. To think that way is not only naive but ignorant and short sighted. It seems that social apathy, which Asian Americans are famous for, has only exasperated the problem. We, as a community, seem to have difficulty in understanding that every action causes a ripple effect. A better definition is the traditional "Chaos Theory."

Life isn't difficult to figure out. I'm not sure why people make it so complicated. Things happen for a reason if someone just used some old fashioned common sense.

It's sad since I know 3 great Asian American guys who just gave up and moved to Asia where they're really happy. And no, they don't have a condescending attitude towards the natives there. I guess they just wanted to feel like they belonged where they were never "second choice" like they are here in North America. Hell, more power to them.

[jaehwan]

However, I also don't think there's ever a good reason to become trigger-happy with issues. If an Asian-American man approaches me and I reject him, I'm really pissed if he immediately turns around and calls me a sell-out. And eventually, it'll become a self-fulfilling prophecy; if he comes into every situation with a bad attitude thinking every Asian-American woman he meets will be a CCB, she'll reject him and then he'll throw himself another pity-party saying, "See, I was right, she WAS a CCB!" You know what I'm saying?

I think you have to be exclusive. On the Pirate thread (http://www.thefighting44s.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5877), mao talks about being exclusive. Every activist wants to save everyone, but every activist also needs people to save him or her. Understand that there is a difference between people; not everyone will understand and not everyone will have the capacity to get over certain issues. You can't please everyone. Sometimes it's best to walk away from those who can't be helped just so you can spend more time with those who already get it.

[kwak76]

Tokyolovestory,

I could see your side. Asian men do have a responsibility where they have to take control of their own action. If I get rejected by an Asian women I used thought she might just prefer white guys but I realize I was being insecure. Now I don't give a fuck.

I had to beat the system and realize that not everyone is like that. I had to take control of my own action. It goes both ways. Asian men have to become secure with their own identity and feel good about being Asian. Asian women also have to feel the same.

I think some of the reason why we have CCB is because Asian women just hate the Asian part of themselves. (I think.) Asian men who act bitter give more reason why an Asian women should date out.

Yeah, it does suck but I blame white imperialism and the force feeding of white is best that fucked us in the head.

My best advice is you know who you are and you know what you like. Don't let others say other wise. I read some of your threads. You sound wise for your age and I think Jaehwan nailed it in his post. Just like CCB are the lost sheeps so are those bitter Asian men. Don't let it get it to you.

[kwak76]

uRB4N,

You live in NYC. I PM you if you want to meet up. Up to you if you want. I think I could explain things clearer in person.

I felt that way too. I wanted to quit and move back to Asia and find a life over there thinking it be better. I actually know two Asian American guys that did that. They found a wife over there and life is good. These guys were good guys but could not find a girl in NYC. Yeah..dating in NYC is tough if your Asian male but you know what.....

It falls on US to CHANGE that. I go out every weekend approaching and talking to women and I go out get and rejected every so often but I look at it as step closer to the girl that would be in my life.

Asian guys do have it harder but I realize that Asian guys that hack it are strong mofo . Stronger than any white boy because they didn't have to deal with the shit we have to deal with.

I realize the solution to the inter-racial or ccbs is that Asian men have to become BETTER. We have to become more successful and we have to prove ourselves more everyday. Not all of us will hack it and some of us will quit or become bitter. I could understand but it falls in this generation that has to do it. If not this generation than what scares me is that we won't have another Asian generation.

Asian men have to take control of their own action. It's easy to fall into the bitter mode because it's SO EASY but that's what the white men wants. Fuck CCB's . The greatest revenge you can have against any white racist or Asian sell out is being happy with who you are and not have anyone effect you.

It's not easy but just like the first generation had to work hard to put us through school . This generation of Asian men are not doing enough stepping up to the plate and standing up.

[kwak76]

I just have to add. When it comes to CCB's . You can't really talk to them. Even if you use compassion to show them the racist element in how they date does not work..if it comes from an Asian man.

I think that Asian women has to talk to other Asian women who are CCB's. I think they would be more open to talking to them.

I realize when it comes to bitter Asian men the best people to turn to are other Asian men who could show compassion but the better way. That's what I think.

[nightshade]

I just have to add. When it comes to CCB's . You can't really talk to them. Even if you use compassion to show them the racist element in how they date does not work..if it comes from an Asian man.

I think that Asian women has to talk to other Asian women who are CCB's. I think they would be more open to talking to them.


Unfortunately, this does not work. I've tried, but it just leads to bullshit. Most CCBs don't consider Asian chicks to be sisters.

I think some CCBs don't even think of themselves as Asian.

It makes my heart hurt.

[RebelAzn]

This whole situation is turning into a big vicious circle. It is almost like Asian Americans need some sort of secret handshake to say are you down with Asian Americans or not. Perhaps in the future there will be more of organized effort to establish a more clear Asian American identity. Part of issue is having multiple Asian ethnicities. Hopefully, future generation will form more of an Asian American identity. We certainly should use the Internet as the main tool since the media certainly won't help in this regard.

That being said, I have no idea NYC is that bad. A couple guys I know there pretty much gave up on Asian women there too. I don't think it is healthy for future generation of Asian American men to hate Asian American women. Those CCBs fail to realize their kids will go through the same vicious cycle whether they are full Asian or hapa. It is a problem that affect both men and women.

I think one of the issue is many Asian American kids today lack true role models in the media. Parents really have to step up and be good role models. Most Asian American kids I know that have a fairly healthy outlook in life and are proud of their Asian heritage usually come from stable strong family backgrounds. If any of us ever have kids, make sure we teach our kids to be proud of whoever vs. leaving them to school system here or the media. We all know what will happen if we do that. The system is fucked up for Asian Americans, so we just have to try to deal with the best we can.

Meanwhile, I think Internet is the best tool to spread out share our experiences. Even CCBs have to turn on their computers at some point and surf the net.

[NICENURSE]

I had no idea that this was such a huge issue in the Asian community. In general the Asian people Iwork with and see on a regular basis here in Missouri, seem to have it all. Marriage, great families and careers. I work in a hospital were almost half the doctors are asian. Most all are married. I never have thought that Asian people did not suffer racism. I just did not know it was so bad in your community. What I admire is that you let nothing keep you from your goals. Asian men are very successful, ambitious, and the ones I see on a regular very kind. I guess I am just surprised that Asian women are not climibing all over you. I guess Asians and blacks do have alot more in common than we think. Especially Asian men and black women.

[uRB4N]

I don't think I need any clarification.

To be honest, it could just be the area of NYC. An Asian friend said that it made her very uncomfortable. It was disconcerting to see that almost every Asian woman here was with a white man. Perhaps it might be a bad idea to move here. It's a shame really, I always wanted to live in the city.

Russell Peters was doing a comedy show here last week and he noticed an Asian woman and man in the front row. If you've ever been to a comedy show, you know better than to sit in the front. Anyway, he asked this Asian guy his name and he made the usual racial joke that his real name must sound like a kungfu move. He asked them if they were together. He said no and that they were just coworkers. He asks him if he's single and he responds yes. He turns to the Asian woman and asks if she's single. She responds no.

Without hesitation, he then asks how her parents feel about her dating a white guy. The whole audience was just laughing their asses off. She didn't do anything except look down. He did manage to stick up for Asian guys though. He said that at least he knows why Indian women might flee Indian men because of arranged marriages but he also joked about body odor and being boring engineers but he actually said that there was no real reason for Asian men to get the shaft.

I don't think it's any real surprise to find Asian men to be angry. I'm not just saying that because I'm an Asian guy either, I'm saying it as a human being. This means I also understand why black women are also angry at black men.

[tokyolovestory]

Sorry, Kwak, but nightshade's right. I've tried having that discussion with CCBs. A lot of them already have the attitude that they're "above" me because they see white males as above Asian men and they're dating the "higher status" guy while I'm dating Asian dudes. Or worse, they see me as competition for their white guy (oh please), so then they're downright hostile. I can just be walking around the mall, at a store, or even at WORK (customer service/sales rep) and I'll see a WM/AF couple walk in and she'll sometimes take one look at me and immediately try to leave or give me the nastiest look. It makes me laugh but also irritates the hell out of me.

[jaehwan]

He asks him if he's single and he responds yes. He turns to the Asian woman and asks if she's single. She responds no.

Without hesitation, he then asks how her parents feel about her dating a white guy. The whole audience was just laughing their asses off. She didn't do anything except look down. He did manage to stick up for Asian guys though. He said that at least he knows why Indian women might flee Indian men because of arranged marriages but he also joked about body odor and being boring engineers but he actually said that there was no real reason for Asian men to get the shaft.

Dude,

That is fucking hilarious. Russell Peters is the BOMB! I wish I could've seen that. Is it on youtube?

I haven't been putting too much input into this discussion, but I think it's sometimes good to laugh at it...

[Ike]

I've had the opposite experience with CCBs - granted, they were already my friends or acquaintances, so they had no reason to become hostile. Rather, they treated me like a curious zoo specimen and asked questions like "Why do you find Asian men attractive?" They seemed genuinely interested, but sadly, I don't think I was able to give satisfactory answers. I've tried the media images angle and showing them images of hot Asian guys. Because they're my friends, I'll have plenty more chances to talk with them. Any suggestions on how I should go about it?

[RebelAzn]

I actually dated a few CCBs since I was their first Asian boyfriend. Its funny cause they usually make comments like "oh you are not like other Asian men". After awhile, it gets really annoying trying to change their attitude about Asians in general so I ditched them. It is much easier dating Asian women who are proud of their heritage and respect the Asian culture.

Based on my own experience, these are the traits I found in CCBs. 1) they usually grew up in an all white neighborhood and all their friends were white. 2) they usually don't have great relationships with their parents or are embarrassed by them due to their lack of English speaking skills. 3) they usually never been exposed to Asian American men. 4) they watch TV and their general ideas of Asians come from TV. In other words, they internalized all the stereotypes of Asians by white people and actually think they are true. 5) they are generally very insecure. Oh yeah, they also believe in the white is right since all the movie stars are white men. Of course, there are others but those are some of the general ones I witnessed.

Don't they have Asian parties in NYC?? I remember in SF they used to have like 2 or 3 of those a week. Usually, there are like 500-1000 Asian Americans attending those. I am not sure if they have them in NYC.

Bottom line is before you enter any relationship, you need to know who you are individually. If you are not sure of your own identity, then you gonna have issues in that relationship. Without a doubt, I think attitude of CCBs is detrimental to future generation of Asian Americans. For Asian American men, it is much easier go seek out Asian women who get it (like the ones on this site) than fighting to change CCBs and their attitude.

[RebelAzn]

I've had the opposite experience with CCBs - granted, they were already my friends or acquaintances, so they had no reason to become hostile. Rather, they treated me like a curious zoo specimen and asked questions like "Why do you find Asian men attractive?" They seemed genuinely interested, but sadly, I don't think I was able to give satisfactory answers. I've tried the media images angle and showing them images of hot Asian guys. Because they're my friends, I'll have plenty more chances to talk with them. Any suggestions on how I should go about it?

Take them to a Chinese 9 men Volleyball tournament in your area. I think they have it in Boston. I am almost 100% sure they never seen tall, athletic Asian men before in their life. We used to have those in the SF area. There were a ton of over 6 feet tall Chinese guys here. A few players that played in that tournament also played in the AVP. Kevin Wong and Scott Wong played in those tournaments and both of them played in the Olympics.

Below is the link to the SF one. I am not sure how to look for the one in the Boston area.

http://www.nacivt-sf.com/pics_vids.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75MV8VBgm3U&feature=related

[uRB4N]

My general attitude can be summed up by the quote in signature. In regards to my ethnicity, I've always been proud of who I am and it saddens me that so many Asian women are either ashamed by it or don't find the type of cultural connection attractive.

The reason why I find Asian women to be the most attractive is not on looks but more for cultural reasons and how they remind me of community and who I really am. Ironically, that's one of the most popular excuses why Asian women shun Asian men.

My main point is that life is too short to be angry. It takes alot of energy. If Asian women aren't interested in me, I'm not bitter because other non-Asian women are interested. I'm worth more than that.

[tkguy]

Perhaps in the future there will be more of organized effort to establish a more clear Asian American identity. Part of issue is having multiple Asian ethnicities. Hopefully, future generation will form more of an Asian American identity. We certainly should use the Internet as the main tool since the media certainly won't help in this regard.


It just occurred to me that I don't think I've ever heard anybody talk about a European American identity.

[kwak76]

RebelAsian,

NYC is a mix bag. There are Asian parties like MK production or base etc.

I would say every weekend there is one or two. The problem with these parties is that the numbers are imbalance but I think this is typical for most night scene. In other words not enough Asian female shows up but too many Asian guys shows up.

If you go to the Asian neighborhood like Chinatown to K-town you see mostly Asian crowd . Go to another borough like Queens and scope out flushing there is growing Asian community there too.

So it depends upon where you go . If you go to down town Manhattan toward the east or west side that's where all the CCB's hang out.

I lived in Manhattan for one year and worked around that area and saw 10-20 a day. It fucks your head up if you stay there.

Saying that I meet and hear non-Asian women who are attracted to Asian men and I do meet a fair number of Asian women who are also attracted to Asian men.

I'm not sure where URB4N hangs out but I'm guessing probably around downtown section since that areas has the highest concentration of CCB.

It's like two world really. Go back to flushing all you see is Asian couples (mostly fobs) but go and walk around St. Marks you can re-name it yokojohn lane. I have to add that I see a rise of Asian men with non-Asian women and I still fair number of Asian couples.

[nightshade]

Or worse, they see me as competition for their white guy (oh please), so then they're downright hostile. I can just be walking around the mall, at a store, or even at WORK (customer service/sales rep) and I'll see a WM/AF couple walk in and she'll sometimes take one look at me and immediately try to leave or give me the nastiest look. It makes me laugh but also irritates the hell out of me.

Oh, man. The chicks who are that insecure always have boyfriends who check out other girls all the time. Mostly I feel sorry for girls like this, because they are usually loud and obnoxious and not very cute, and their boyfriends have huge stashes of Asian chick porn. These are the same chicks who exclaim: HE LOVES ME FOR WHO I AM. LOVE IS COLOURBLIND. Hahahahaha.

[Makulita]

I've had the opposite experience with CCBs - granted, they were already my friends or acquaintances, so they had no reason to become hostile. Rather, they treated me like a curious zoo specimen and asked questions like "Why do you find Asian men attractive?" They seemed genuinely interested, but sadly, I don't think I was able to give satisfactory answers. I've tried the media images angle and showing them images of hot Asian guys. Because they're my friends, I'll have plenty more chances to talk with them. Any suggestions on how I should go about it?


.... Make them feel like whitewashed, sellout twinkie bitches.

But seriously, take from us and share the knowledge. You dig around and you'll find a shit ton of eloquently put thoughts on why it isn't soooo fucking weird for an Asian chick to dig Asian dudes.

And since they're your friends, you don't have to wear the baby gloves. You can afford some hostility. You can ask "Why don't you find Asian men attractive?" right back and they probably wouldn't get as offended if I or TLS or nightshade asked in our bitch voices. Get into their heads and plan out how to explain "your side" from there.

----


Oh, man. The chicks who are that insecure always have boyfriends who check out other girls all the time. Mostly I feel sorry for girls like, because they are usually loud and obnoxious and not very cute, and their boyfriends have huge stashes of Asian chick porn. These are the same chicks who exclaim: HE LOVES ME FOR WHO I AM. LOVE IS COLOURBLIND. Hahahahaha.

If their precious boyfriends are colorblind then I shit Christmas suman and kamote Q.

[uRB4N]

Thanks for everyone's input as it's a great learning experience.

It also feels good to know that there are some Asian women that always wanted us from the beginning. Call me old fashioned but I think that's what makes Asian women that hold this mentality to be at the apex of attractiveness. Unfortuantly, searching for these women is like looking for a specific needle in a stack of needles.

What's odd is that is that many of these whitewashed Asian women use the fact that Asian men want them as a tool to manipulate them.

[RebelAzn]

RebelAsian,

NYC is a mix bag. There are Asian parties like MK production or base etc.

I would say every weekend there is one or two. The problem with these parties is that the numbers are imbalance but I think this is typical for most night scene. In other words not enough Asian female shows up but too many Asian guys shows up.

If you go to the Asian neighborhood like Chinatown to K-town you see mostly Asian crowd . Go to another borough like Queens and scope out flushing there is growing Asian community there too.

So it depends upon where you go . If you go to down town Manhattan toward the east or west side that's where all the CCB's hang out.

I lived in Manhattan for one year and worked around that area and saw 10-20 a day. It fucks your head up if you stay there.

Saying that I meet and hear non-Asian women who are attracted to Asian men and I do meet a fair number of Asian women who are also attracted to Asian men.

I'm not sure where URB4N hangs out but I'm guessing probably around downtown section since that areas has the highest concentration of CCB.

It's like two world really. Go back to flushing all you see is Asian couples (mostly fobs) but go and walk around St. Marks you can re-name it yokojohn lane. I have to add that I see a rise of Asian men with non-Asian women and I still fair number of Asian couples.

Kwak - glad to see your new found attitude. I remember going to NYC when I lived in the East Coast years ago and did not witness what URB4N saw. Who knows? Things might have changed.

Just wondering, have you been dating more with your new approach? I imagine you should at least get a lot action than before.

In the Bay Area, there are quite a few WM/AF couples although I would say majority of AFs in those relationships seem to be the FOB type. Also, those couples usually are the nerdy looking type. There are a ton of Asian American couples here. And in recent years, there are now more and more Americanized AMs dating out here too.

[RebelAzn]

Thanks for everyone's input as it's a great learning experience.

It also feels good to know that there are some Asian women that always wanted us from the beginning. Call me old fashioned but I think that's what makes Asian women that hold this mentality to be at the apex of attractiveness. Unfortuantly, searching for these women is like looking for a specific needle in a stack of needles.

What's odd is that is that many of these whitewashed Asian women use the fact that Asian men want them as a tool to manipulate them.

While I understand the bad attitude of CCBs, but I also have little sympathy for Asian men who whine and blame everything on race. You are ultimately responsible for your own life. Some AFs are true CCBs there is nothing you can do for them. Some AFs are in-between. I have dated number of AFs that dated other races of men before me. The only way to be sure is to approach them no matter how bad you think you gonna get rejected.

Therefore, if you see an AF you like, don't assume they are a true CCB. Hell, it never stopped me while I was dating. Just go hitting on them and see what happens. I got plenty of numbers from women that already have boyfriends. Why did they do that? I have no idea. It is not like I want to get involved in love triangles. Unless you have asked hundreds of women out, you should not complain. Blaming everything on race is a total cop out. Being Asian American is something to be proud of. Women should date you because you care unique and confident, not because you are Asian. We should celebrate the fact we are Asian, not keep wondering why being Asian is such a handicap in America. Someone told me being successful is the biggest revenge. I would say Asian men should take that attitude and just be successful. Chinese century will be here soon enough.

[tokyolovestory]

Kwak and Jaehwan--

Yeah, I've basically begun to cut my losses. I'm not so young that I can afford to waste time proving myself, you know? It's just funny (and sad) how much of a difference it makes in many Asian-American men's attitudes once they find out that for most of my dating experience, I've been exclusively going with Asian men. It opens a whole new part of their personality.

haha Makulita, totally agree... Those CCBs don't want to hear anything from me. They already think I'm eyeing their man when in reality I'm just rolling my eyes. And these days my patience is worn so thin, I think I automatically come off sounding like a bitch cuz I'm so tired of hearing these bitches talking smack about Asian men (which is the majority of my friends--and no one talks smack about my friends in front of me) like they've ever dated one before. Hah.

[uRB4N]

Eh, what can you do?

Asian guys just have to roll with life's punches. If Asian American women don't have preference for Asian guys, they could always go to Asia. Not because the women there are easier but because Asian women are everywhere and it certainly increases their chances.

But it feels nice to at least be acknowledged that there is a problem and that it hurts emotionally.

[Makulita]

Kwak and Jaehwan--

haha Makulita, totally agree... Those CCBs don't want to hear anything from me. They already think I'm eyeing their man when in reality I'm just rolling my eyes. And these days my patience is worn so thin, I think I automatically come off sounding like a bitch cuz I'm so tired of hearing these bitches talking smack about Asian men (which is the majority of my friends--and no one talks smack about my friends in front of me) like they've ever dated one before. Hah.

This is why we need to pick a weekend to hang out in Convoy together and spend the day snarking at whatever stuck up bitch with her pasty little boyfriend dares to give us stink eye.

Because, fuck progression for a day, ain't nothin' gonna relieve that stress than holding loud, obnoxious discussion on the disparity when chicks give us loud and obnoxious bitch looks.

Stuck Up Self-Hater: *STARE*

.....

Makulita: SO, TLS, YOU SEE THAT CHICK RIGHT THERE? ITS LIKE DAMN, FUCKIN' TWENTY THIRD WHITEBOY/ASIAN CHICK COUPLE I'VE SEEN THIS WEEK.

tokyolovestory: ORLY? THAT'S THE FORTY SIXTH ONE I SAW.

Makulita: BITCHES MUST BE CRAZY, ASIAN MEN ARE FUCKING GORGEOUS. IF I WASN'T SO FUCKING VIRTUOUS I'D JUMP EACH AND EVERY FINE LOOKIN' BROTHA ON THE STREET.

tokyolovestory: WERD, YO. YOU KNOW THEM BITCHES DO IT FOR SOCIAL MOBILITY BECAUSE IF THEY GO AND DATE "DOWN" BY GETTIN' WITH A BROTHA ALL HER OTHER DAIRY QUEEN FRIENDS'RE GONNA MAKE FUN OF HER.

Makulita: SHIT IS PAINFUL. CHICK SHOULD JUST SWITCH BODIES WITH A WHITE GIRL SO THE CRAP COMING OUT HER MOUTH DON'T SOUND AS FUCKED UP AS IT DOES RACIST.

tokyolovestory: F'REALIES. ....Let's go get some Pinkberry!

Makulita: Awesome, and afterwards we can go to Curry House! Let's bounce!

[jaehwan]

Kwak and Jaehwan--

Yeah, I've basically begun to cut my losses. I'm not so young that I can afford to waste time proving myself, you know? It's just funny (and sad) how much of a difference it makes in many Asian-American men's attitudes once they find out that for most of my dating experience, I've been exclusively going with Asian men. It opens a whole new part of their personality.


You're right, tokyo.

I think we Asian men are somewhat repressed when it comes to talking about the issues that most affect us. A lot of it has to do with the current educational system. Kingstonism runs rampant, and the moment an Asian guy opens his mouth to discuss the issue, we get the "you don't own me" speech. That's why I think everyone here is doing the right thing by bringing this out in the forefront. It makes it easier for EVERYONE.

By the way, Makulita, you scare me...

[jaehwan]

Urb4N, I just posted you on the front page:

http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/02/13/so-what-do-your-parents-think-about-the-white-guy/

[uRB4N]

Not sure I wanted to be famous. :)

Oh, in regards to why Asian women aren't seen as causing 50% of the problems when discussing this issue, I think it's because they're afford some "social protection" just like black people. These little bits of social protection are awarded to people who white people think are either "safe" or have white guilt about.

[Makulita]

What? Fuck you, I'm sweet as pie.

[RebelAzn]

What? Fuck you, I'm sweet as pie.

I agree. You are sweet as pie. I totally dig the attitude. Frankly, I wish all the Asian chicks are like you.

[Makulita]

.....

Bitches wish they were this fierce.

[nskripchun]

Makulita: SO, TLS, YOU SEE THAT CHICK RIGHT THERE? ITS LIKE DAMN, FUCKIN' TWENTY THIRD WHITEBOY/ASIAN CHICK COUPLE I'VE SEEN THIS WEEK.

tokyolovestory: ORLY? THAT'S THE FORTY SIXTH ONE I SAW.

Makulita: BITCHES MUST BE CRAZY, ASIAN MEN ARE FUCKING GORGEOUS. IF I WASN'T SO FUCKING VIRTUOUS I'D JUMP EACH AND EVERY FINE LOOKIN' BROTHA ON THE STREET.

tokyolovestory: WERD, YO. YOU KNOW THEM BITCHES DO IT FOR SOCIAL MOBILITY BECAUSE IF THEY GO AND DATE "DOWN" BY GETTIN' WITH A BROTHA ALL HER OTHER DAIRY QUEEN FRIENDS'RE GONNA MAKE FUN OF HER.

Makulita: SHIT IS PAINFUL. CHICK SHOULD JUST SWITCH BODIES WITH A WHITE GIRL SO THE CRAP COMING OUT HER MOUTH DON'T SOUND AS FUCKED UP AS IT DOES RACIST.

tokyolovestory: F'REALIES. ....Let's go get some Pinkberry!

Makulita: Awesome, and afterwards we can go to Curry House! Let's bounce!

hahaha, too funny.

[nightshade]

.....

Bitches wish they were this fierce.

Tyra Banks has nothing on you.

P.S. You and TLS better eat a vat of Pinkberry for me while you go on your beat down mission. I miss Pinkberry.

[Makulita]

There's another one in Downtown San Diego now!

It was in one of those partially covered corner stores, near the tracks across the convention center. Probably opened now... and flooded with fucking scenesters and hippies.

[tokyolovestory]

Makulita:

Tell me what day and time, I'll totally be there. CCBs are getting WAY too comfortable on Convoy. When I was in high school, that shit was OURS!

[JadeDragon]

I wanna hang out with you girls.

[jaehwan]

What? Fuck you, I'm sweet as pie.

I didn't mean to single you out. You ALL scare me. But you're also all sweet as pie...

[USCTrojansDaBest]

Throwing my two cents here...

Quite frankly, a lot of Asian guys I know are total hypocrites. They would react strongly, sometimes even violently, whenever they hear or see an Asian girl with a white guy. Yet these very same Asian guys would go out of their way to bang a white girl.

Asian guys of course justify their actions by claiming that since Asian girls are dating white guys, it's okay for Asian guys to bang white girls. So some of these Asian guys do it (flaunt their white girlfriends) to spite their Asian female counterparts.

And sorry to say this, but from my experiences, the reason why white girls are interested in Asian men is the same reason they are interested in old, bald white guys: $$$$$$

Seriously, many white girls think that Asian men are all rich, smart, and financially successful and that they own a bigarse mansion and fancy cars, and yachts, and all that other fancy crap. White girls see Asian men like sugar daddies. THAT'S why White girls are interested in Asian men.

At the same time, many of these Asian men would often exploit their model minority stereotype (That they're highly educated and rich with lots of money) to try and bang white girls.

HTH

[nskripchun]

Throwing my two cents here...

Quite frankly, a lot of Asian guys I know are total hypocrites. They would react strongly, sometimes even violently, whenever they hear or see an Asian girl with a white guy. Yet these very same Asian guys would go out of their way to bang a white girl.

Asian guys of course justify their actions by claiming that since Asian girls are dating white guys, it's okay for Asian guys to bang white girls. So some of these Asian guys do it (flaunt their white g