High Suicide Rates among Asian-American Women

[atlasien]

I read about this recently at a couple different places. I was always under the assumption that Native Americans had the highest suicide rates, but it turns out that young and elderly Asian-American women are the most at risk.

I hope there's more research that gets done on this. My feeling is that for young women, it's a combination of internal and external factors. Internal meaning family pressure to succeed and do well in school, external meaning racism, both from peers and from the media.

I don't have as much of a feeling for what causes the rate to be so high for elderly women.

Mental Health and Depression in Asian Americans

* Three decades of research on mental health show that Asian Americans exhibit high numbers of depressive symptoms as well as confounding factors such as war experiences, abuse, and stress.
* Of reported data, Asian American women over the age of 65 have the highest female suicide mortality rate among women across all racial/ethnic groups. Among women aged 15 - 24, Asian American girls have the highest suicide mortality rates across all racial/ethnic groups.
* Asian American adolescent girls have the highest rates of depressive symptoms of all racial/ethnic and gender groups.
* Asian American college students report higher levels of depressive symptoms than white students.
* Asian American adolescent boys are twice as likely as whites to have been physically abused, and three times as likely to report sexual abuse.
* Asian Americans have the lowest utilization for mental health services and are more likely to have psychotic diagnoses in inpatient and outpatient settings. Studies further show that Asian Americans have greater disturbance levels than do non-Asian clients.


Mental Health and Depression in Asian Americans- Specific Subgroups

* Chinese, Filipino, Japanese, and Korean immigrants consistently report higher numbers of depressive symptoms than whites.
* Studies show that Chinese Americans have a lifetime prevalence rate of major depression as high as 17%, with 10% reporting a major depression within the past year.
* 71% of Southeast Asians meet the criteria for a major affective disorder (which includes depression), with Hmong (85%) and Cambodians (81%) showing the highest rates. Moreover, 70% of Southeast Asian refugees are found to have post-traumatic stress disorder.

http://www.kcceb.org/campaign/mental/english/content.cfm?file=fact
National Asian Women's Health Organization

[Heyyu]

Hmm, I remember a simliar article being posted on here before, but my 2 cents:

I'm not surprised. AA's in general face enormous social pressure to succeed. Especially the East Asian groups like Chinese and Koreans, whose families place the most emphasis on academic success and job success. And the model minority stereotype trickles down to all the other Asian groups like the Filipinos, Cambodians, Laotians, etc.

Although in the case of the Cambodians and Laotians, many are newly settled immigrations and from much poorer socioeconomic brackets than the Chinese/Koreans (many of whom, due to strict immigration control, are the self-selected educated top 1% who have the money and the credentials to come over to the US and find good jobs). Well not the case with EVERYONE, but generally-speaking the Chinese and Koreans come from higher socioeconomic brackets than other SE Asian groups like the Hmong & Laotians.

So therefore in school the Hmong and Laotian kids have to face the same "model minority" standards that the Chinese and Koreans do. But studies have shown that wealth usually corresponds to educational achievement (in all racial groups). In other words, the richer the family, the better educated their kids usually are (partly due to access to better schools & neighborhoods). And more emphasis on education from their high-achieving parents who push them to excel like they did (especially in the case of the Chinese/Korean/Indian kids).

But imagine you're a refugee Cambodian kid and then trust into a new environment. Even though your English is poor and your education background was almost zilch since you probably couldn't even attend grade school in Cambodia. Your family was worrying about finding food to eat and watching others die around them (already a traumatic experience)... and then boom, suddenly you have to adjust to a new school in America with all these high-achieving Chinese and Korean kids whose parents pushed them to get into Harvard ever since they could crawl. It's like 2 separate worlds. So yeah, that's prime territory for some serious mental problems later on in life.

And then back to the Chinese and Korean and Filipino kids. Not everyone can get into Harvard or Yale or Princeton or MIT or Stanford or John Hopkins Medical School. I mean, there's more high school kids than ever before applying to college in America, so the competition is much greater. And the prestigious universities that Asians dream of going to simply don't have the slots open, not to mention that Asians are held to higher standards compared to other groups. So while 10 years ago a 3.5 GPA with a 1345 SAT score was once good enough to get an Asian kid into UCLA (and for anyone curious, I just used my cousin as an example, lol). Nope, now that Asian kid has to get a 3.8 GPA with a 2145 SAT score and recommendations and some superlative extra-curricular activity.

So not everyone can be the model minority, and those that fall through the crack might feel like they're left behind and become depressed (when really, where you go to school is not the end-all and be-all of your existence... many people have succeeded without going to a top-name school). It's more important with what you do with your life and how you approach life after dealing with failure (cause failure hits EVERYONE, including the Harvard grads). And yes, one of the prime culprits for the high and unusual depression rate amongst Asian kids is due to their Asian parents, who despite good intentions, have put needless pressure on their kids to succeed when success is not really a one-way street (their are many ways to succeed in life... not just "GET INTO HARVARD!").

And one thing I've noticed is that the high-achieving Asian females in particular (and I mean the ones accustomed to success all their lives) are the ones who are hit the most when they don't reach their target. So if they fail to get into their university of choice or get that job promotion or whatever... it's like their life falls apart before their very eyes.

I don't know why this is... perhaps females in general are more judgemental on themselves than guys? Because females are used to being judged... for instance, on beauty. So they're more conscious of their appearance and how they appear to others around them. For Asian females, that extends to not only beauty but academic and career achievement. So anything less than the best will make them feel inadequate to others around them.

Finally, here's my controversial theory on the high depression rate amongst old lonely Asian females. Ok, honestly, Asian females are some of the most superficial beings I have ever met in my life. The emphasis on status and wealth and where you went to school amongst Asian females is sickening (particularly East Asian girls). But here's a cold hard fact: everyone gets old. Especially in regards to the Asian females that relied on their youthfulness and perhaps beauty to get ahead (i.e. using the Asian doll stereotype to work/sleep their way up). But all that's left when they get old is their personality.

Hence many old Asian females in the States suddenly find themselves unwanted and useless. Why? Because they were superficial primadonna Asian bitches when they were younger and no wants to deal with their crap anymore. Hence, they will be tossed aside for the younger flavors. As the cliched saying goes, who you are as a person matters more than anything else (since everyone gets old and beauty fades). If you are genuinely a good person, you will have friends and find longer happiness when you're old and decrepit. So in a way, I do believe the truly nice girls will win out in the end over the gold-digging bitches who will fall by the wayside. And this extends to girls of all races and ethnicities.

[atlasien]

I disagree with that theory. It's not logical, since it treats women of all generations as having the same psychology and worldview. It's woman-hating and disrespects the elderly and is incredibly depressing.

I hope you can get over this thing that took you over halfway through your post and start developing more of a capacity to feel empathy towards fellow human beings.

There's no known correlation between being superficial and being suicidal. In fact, being "superficial" is pretty hard to define in the first place.

You could blame white women for being superficial for being overly attracted to rich men and rockstars and slutting around like Paris Hilton. You could blame black women for being superficial for all the "I don't want no scrubs" lines. Where does all that misogyny get us? You could also blame all men for being superficial because all they care about is money and cars and penis size and blaming women. Maybe that's why men kill themselves more than women do. :rolleyes:

[Scowl]

Total guess on my part, I don't really have anything solid to base my opinions on but I'd say that population size is a large factor. Not only are AAs a tiny portion of the population, but even among AAs there are very few who actually subscribe to some kind of broad AA identity. So a Chinese kid and a Korean kid may feel some kinship towards one another..... or they could have more in common with their white friends. Being surrounded by people who are different in almost every way tends to arouse feelings of alienation, loneliness, and culture clash. This happens even in places with high concentrations of Asians, so if you're out in the boonies living in whiteville, USA, you're fucked. Why do we have so many self-hating Asians? Because people just want to fit in.

Yeah, Asian parents are certainly a part of it, but I'd say that falls under "culture clash." Growing up in the US means that we generally have a different idea than our parents of what love and family means. And you can't just blame the parents, because AA kids can be a bunch of ungrateful little fucks, too.

And all that comes from just being Asian. I can't even imagine what it must be like for a woman. As a little kid, I remember being grateful that I was born a guy. For all the shit that an AAM gets, it's still a man's world.

[tkguy]

This is a serious subject and it should be analyze carefully before taking any type of action.

The problem with statistics on asians is in the us is that it does not seperate the first generation from those who were born here. It does not acknowledge that there are very different sub groups that make up the asian population.

chinese make up about a quarter of all asians in the us. China is the only country in which women commit suicide more often then men in some parts. It is also generally true that females in asian countries commit suicide at least twice as often as the women in america.

http://www.who.int/mental_health/prevention/suicide/suiciderates/en/

One can conclude that the high suicide rate of af is probably largely due to possibly first generation immigrants.

Am in the 15-25 age range are however 2.5 times as likely to commit suicide than af. However, they are less likely than wm to do so in the same age group.

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr55/nvsr55_10.pdf

What I find interesting is that it seems that in the asian countries the males generally commit suicide a little over twice as often as the females. While in the US men commit suicide 6 times as more often as wf between the ages of 15 and 25. but still the ratio between af and am seems consistent with the ratio in asian countries.

Then it hit me. The 15-25 af set are probably mostly foreign students. The ratios are higher because these foreign students are adding factors that eschew the general trends amongst Asians who are actually living in the US.

Is there anything in the report that I referenced above that indicates that foreign students are being left out?

As for the over 65 set. The eldest asian people I meet are usually women who’s husbands have passed away a long long time ago. It doesn’t take a genius to figure out why they are depressed.

[atlasien]

I agree it's very complicated.

What makes it even more complicated is the fact that suicide rates are also balanced with suicide attempts. That's one basic reason men have higher suicide rates than women. They attempt it less, but succeed more, especially when they use guns. Guns are a huge factor in suicide rates. Groups with higher access to guns have higher suicide rates.

I would have to disagree with the foreign student hypothesis though, unless someone does a study along those lines. The reason is other studies and articles like this one:

The first national study of Asian-American mental health finds that the second generation is more likely than their immigrant parents to have emotional disorders. (http://www.apa.org/monitor/feb06/health.html)

Recent immigrants are more likely to have strong extended family ties. They also expect less out of life if they come from a poorer country, so they're not as disappointed when things go wrong. African-Americans also have lower suicide rates than white people and I've often heard the explanation that it's because family ties and community relations are more present than with white people. So having strong family ties decreases some kinds of mental illness and depression, but doesn't have effect on other areas of mental illness. For example, a group of Cambodian refugee immigrants might have strong family ties and support network but still suffer from massive untreated PTSD.

So I think racism, and lack of connectedness, is a strong factor on the higher suicide rate of the 15-25 age group.

[RebelAzn]

All I know is if I ever have a daughter I gonna make sure she knows how to play sports and is well-rounded. I don't even care if she goes to any ivy. In fact, I hope she does not cause all the academic pressure could mean jack in real life. All I want her to be is be a strong person with a strong Asian identity and American identity and never back down from any asshole who tries to take advantage of her. I gonna teach her how to communicate with people vs. just book smart.

I really freaking wish Asian parents support their kids to play more sports. Damn my parents was totally against me and brothers taking any sports in high school. Thank god we did not listen and most of us played football and wrestled. We turned out ok.

All this model minority crap is just annoying. I am not even sure it even translates to life long success. 85% of CEOs in this country did not go to ivies if it tells you anything.

[atlasien]

I was just at a conference a few weeks ago that talked about positive male parenting. I'd agree that sports are good, but I want to qualify that, because not everyone is good at sports... one of the presenters talked about "structured extracurricular activities that involve boys and men". This is for raising both boys and girls, by the way. The idea is to get kids comfortable with social interactions in a safe place. You could do this on a softball team or a hiking club or a hobby group.

The conference was about kids in the foster care system, and the focus was on positive male role models (usually but not always fathers). If the kids don't get positive male attention growing up the outcome is that they get it in negative ways when they are older... joining gangs or falling in with pimps.

I'm kind of straying off here but I do see a link between the stuff we learned there and raising healthy Asian-American daughters. The key is trying to counteract all the horrible media stereotypes while making sure they are confident in social situations and have the social skills to form supportive links with a community.

[DONKEY]

the stories are written in a way that makes it impossible to understand the issue as anything other than an inherent problem with "Asian" cultures.
Asian American women are less likely to do other things that would lead to an early death like: drive drunk, use hard drugs, join a gang, go to prison, play with guns, eat fast food etc.
young women of other groups die too fast from other things so they don't even have a chance to commit suicide.
i also think the general experience of being an Asian American and not having strong links with other AAs has something to do with this.

[SamuraiJack]

Here's a question:

How do Asian men compare to white men in suicide rates?
How do women compare to men overall for suicide rates?

If women rank higher than men, and Asian men higher than white men, then perhaps it's not an "Asian women" thing, but more of an "Asian" and "female" thing.

So pinpointing Asian women is wrong, instead it should looked at two angles: being Asian (which affects Asian men as well), and being a woman.

[ktkbs]

* Asian American adolescent boys are twice as likely as whites to have been physically abused, and three times as likely to report sexual abuse.

Note that unlike all other races except Native Americans, these crimes are almost always committed by a different race perpetrator.

Another thing to note is that more traditionally raised Asian women have lower suicide risk. The ones who have the highest amount of depressive symptoms are Americanized Asians and war brides.

[AZN MAN]

I'm having a difficult time believing that AA adolescent boys are three times as likely to report sexual abuse than their white counterparts. Since the link in the original post is dead, does anybody have any data to support this?

While I'm unfamiliar with other Asian cultures, in Japanese culture a shameful act/event and the ramifications are looked down upon and not discussed.

Examples:

1. A friend came to the U.S.; he is the progeny of an affair his father had with a prostitute. He is considered shameful and his father refused to parent him.

2. Disfigured victims of the atomic bombs are considered as embarrassments to Japanese society and are considered outcasts.

[ktkbs]

it's not too far out there. most statistics like that are indicative of their own race perpeptrating the given crime at a certain rate. however, crimes against asian americans are overwhelmingly perpetrated by whites and blacks. the same is true for native americans; not only are 34% of native american women raped in their lifetimes, in 90% of these crimes the victim identifies the attacker as black or white.

i would not doubt that it's mainly white men molesting young asian boys.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/25/AR2007042502778.html

The rape and humiliation has never ended.

[NICENURSE]

I love what you wrote. I also had no idea suicide was so high among Asian females. I always heard how Asians in general put alot more emphasis on getting an education and being successful, which I admire. I just hate to hear that these ladies are taking such a permanent way out.

[Anarchrist]

Here's a statistic that can probably shed some light based on population weight alone:

http://www.rfa.org/english/news/social/2003/09/17/115741/

Long story short, Chinese females (as in females in China) constitute the highest suicide population rate in the world.

A few good points were made on this thread concerning most studies' lack of separation between first and second generation Asians. I wouldn't put academic pressures too high on the list of reasons for suicide. Although Asian parents can be forceful about education many poor Asian immigrant families (and when we say Asians in America, face it, its mostly Chinese) put school surprisingly low on the list of priorities when compared to generating some immediate income.

I read an article not long ago on the same subject. It theorized that familial structures in China, especially in rural areas, can be incredibly oppressive towards daughters - usually making suicide attempts one of the few routes to which they can express some form of empowerment. Its a common theory applied to suicidal pathologies, although, the dynamics may be mucked up by cultural differences.

It went on to say that a large portion of suicides were probably not intentional. Essentially, to fake a suicide attempt is usually effective enough to garner the attention that is sought. However, given the poor medical infrastructure and considerably lethal methods of suicide used in rural China (such as imbibing industrial pesticides) many faked suicide-attempts unfortunately turn into real suicides.

My bet is that the suicide rate in AA females comes from the spillover. Likely in low income immigrant families.

Anyway, Hungary has the highest suicide rate in the world. I wonder what's wrong with those people.

[ktkbs]

Long story short, Chinese females (as in females in China) constitute the highest suicide population rate in the world.

This is because pesticides are more lethal than Tylenol.

[CJF]

Lesson to be learned= Amy Tan novels cause depression