What made you a Fighting44? Post experiences here.

[I Eat Baby Seals]

So what made you guys Fighting44s? When did you finally realize that all was not right in the world and that there were large numbers of your own race willing to sell out? What made you so angry?

My intention is to start a thread where people can relate the experiences that made them the pissed off mofos that they are today. Apologies if there's another thread like this. Hopefully this thread can be made a sticky.

[powerislife]

At its most basic form, I got tired of seeing our culture corrupted, our people giving up their identity in the name of conformity, and the marginalization of our people.

LIFT YOUR FIST.

[King_Kai]

I found this site through www.asian-man.com (back when they still had good discussions going on) and the "features" are what attracted me to this site.

When did you finally realize that all was not right in the world and that there were large numbers of your own race willing to sell out?

It'd probably be freshman year of high school, when Better Luck Tomorrow came out. I was talking to my friends when the substitute teacher came up to us and told us about the movie, how it had an all asian cast and we should go see it because you never see asian guys in movies, etc.

[Saikadelik]

I looked around and saw the decline of the Asian race in general...our women flocking to white(and other) men, our people breaking traditions and leaving behind their culture...
Then I also saw the decline of all other races...and I understand the importance to preserve our own kind, because we need diversity, not some nazi melting pot...

I found the 44s through one of those silly asian kid forums like asiansinc...read what you guys stood for, and joined up!

Long live the 44's!

[ThatsJustSick]

Pretext: I use to live in the Inland Empire (30 miles east of Los Angeles), a region of southern california that is predominately white and mexican. Blacks were only concentrated in a few neighborhoods. Asians were even more rare.

The high school I went to only had about 40 asians (9th-12th). There was only about 10 in my entire class. There were AM and AF sell outs. About 1/3 of the asians that wanted nothing to do with their own kind. They wouldn't literally spit on us because we would kick their asses. They considered themselves honorary whites. Whatever, I didn't really care to notice then.

I starting noticing the disparities shortly after high school. The malls would be packed with nothing but CCB's. Everywhere I go, it would be like this. Some non-asian guys would try to hang around us because they thought it would be a great source of asian females. Funny how they were all into asian cultures and anime. [Oh yeah, she's gonna really want you now! CCB's aren't into asian culture, they reject it. So stop trying so hard to be asian. Be your white selves and they will flock to you.]

Seeing an abundant of my sisters friends choosing the CCB lifestyle, I wondered why? I asked her why do they date only white guys now? All I got were a bunch of bull shit answers. I won't go into depth what those excuses are but one of them I remember most was, "She use to have an asian boyfriend and he use to beat her". Okay? So that automatically means every other asian guy out there will beat her? And how do you know she's not just saying that to justify her CCB habits?

However, I moved down to Orange County (30 miles SE of Los Angeles), a region of Southern California with a pretty large asian community. Now, I see less of those damn CCB's and more of a preservation of our culture. Still, in the back of my mind, I know as soon as I leave my county, I will again see the huge disparities. Just because we're not affected by CCB's that much doesn't mean we're immuned. The trend could grow to our area. That's why I will continue to fight!

[evil_FUX]

But as for myself, I guess I had similar experiences going through the back of my mind. It wasn't until about maybe 4 years ago when I really started to notice how our culture once again became the flavor of the week. I would have to say that was the catalyst.

[YellowPages]

So what made you guys Fighting44s? When did you finally realize that all was not right in the world and that there were large numbers of your own race willing to sell out? What made you so angry?

My intention is to start a thread where people can relate the experiences that made them the pissed off mofos that they are today. Apologies if there's another thread like this. Hopefully this thread can be made a sticky.

Reading Malcolm X was a huge turning point in my life. Things just started to make sense after that.

[Taliesin Stormheller]

-Getting my ass kicked repeatedly by older white MALES as a kid.
-Having people laugh openly and spit in my face because of the confluence of my obesity, gothness, and race, and being the only Asian person to fight back. (One Asian kid I know actually LAUGHED. I smacked his ass.)
-Being the butt of jokes and bullying for my whole life because of my race, immigration status, height, weight, large glasses, mental illness, learning disability, and appearance.
-Seeing so much SHIT in the media, etc.
-Being called a race traitor for being a metalhead and being hated by white/black metalheads.
-Having to give up my SEXUALITY and DATING LIFE for the goth metal lifestyle that I love.
-Asian guys in the metal scene only dating white/black/Latina girls, Asian girls in the metal scene only dating white/black/Latino guys.
-Learning about the Black civil rights movement and Malcolm X and wondering- WHY DIDN'T WE HAVE CIVIL RIGHTS?

[eskargot]

Im surprised that so many people only became 44 after a while (not that I'm judging). I became a 44 whenI was 10... precocious I know.

I remember the incident so vividly. I was at home, one day when my 7 year old sister came back home crying. When I asked her what was wrong, she told me some punk ass white boys had been giving her some racial. I went down there with my bro and my cousin and confronted these mofos, after they gave us some kung fu noises and jokes about takeaways.

I challenged this kid, who was 12. to a fight (age making a huge difference at that when you're 10). I managed to floor the tosser but eventually he got me down, while my cousin and bro ran away. That incident taught me that no matter your resolve, no matter your conviction a chinaman is still fair game if you wanna vent abit of anger. There is no justice. The only person who stuck up for me was my mother (A true 44 if ever there was one), who came out and told the kids to go f%ck themselves.

[Dialectic]

Great posts, guys! Thanks for sharing, and please continue.

For a little on our thoughts on 44 and how we got started, read some of the Letters from Kunlun, especially the highly-entertaining earlier ones.

I actually don't know where, but I'm pretty sure at some point I transcribed the fateful bubble tea conversation between Lopan, Sheki, and I that conceived the 44s. First one to find it gets to spank PKC!

[SO_ANGRY]

For me, it started about being bitter about being lower middle class, almost poor as a child. I saw other kids had it better than me. I still have it 'till this day. So at a very young age I was already aware of social issues and wanted to change them.

I was somewhat aware of the selloutism Asians have. But I was still young then and was blind. Abercrombie and Fitch's atrocities really made me mad like around junior high. The fact it's still selling is making me angrier. Also during junior high, that's when kids start trying to find their place in society. Most of you know what happens from there, i'm not going to even bother it's so common.

Oh and my name so_angry isn't because i'm angry, though it fits the site perfectly, it's really an inside joke my cousin and I have. I'm angry, but I have more pitty towards those weaker than me, and dissapointment, I sound like an elitist saying that but it's true.

I found this site through MM.com i'm invers3 there.

[.vhg//ALITA]

When I started reading angryasianman.

[Le Sheng Liu]

My first interest in seeking justice for myself wasn't as an Asian American, but as a drug user. Funny, I was always so anti-drug throughout my youth. When I actually started using, it became apparent how stigmatized and marginalized I was and that I had to keep my behavior in the closet. This really pissed me off and ignited my role in drug education and drug policy reform. Eventually, my activism expanded to other issues such as the Iraq war. Throughout all this, I worked with mostly white activists. It sort of sucked not having any Asian colleagues who gave a rat's ass about the causes I was fighting for. And this was a radical shift for me cuz growing up, my schools had no white students and all my friends were basically Asian. So I sort of experienced an identity crisis in college: having to detach myself from my Asian circles to engage in activities I cared about. So it was just a matter of time before my political & social interests included Asian American issues where (hopefully) I'd actually meet some Asians who have something to say about current eventz. That's why I started brwosing sites such as this one and AngryAsianMan.

[rabidbonobo]

i grew up in the suburbs of new york until I was about seven, riding up and down my block on a bike with elm trees and all that shit.

then our family moved to asia and lived there for a few years and then moved back to the U.S, this time in a white suburb of Connecticut where I was only one of maybe a handful of asians in our middle school.

life was overall good. but i remember one memory when i joined the baseball team when i was in 1st grade and i was catcher. Some white kid kicked me in the ass when i was squatting all of a sudden and I had no idea why. I was mad but didn't do anything. I know now why he did it though.

I would be going back and forth between international school in asia and the U.S. until i got to college. There i didn't give a fuck about studying and really had no idea what i'd do with my life. then Seattle and the anti-WTO demonstrations caught my interest. from then on i became interested in activist issues, anti-capitalism, anarchism, and social issues. I read a lot of Chomsky. I even joined an anarchist collective, went to meetings and demonstrations, etc...

i burned out after a couple of years and my grades were shit so i was suspended from college. I then moved back to asia to "take a break" but wound up staying there for three years working, learning language, traveling, hanging out, making friends.

Now i'm back. Recently read "Soledad Brother" by george jackson, walked down martin luther boulevard, struggling with my inner fears, trying to overcoming my internalized racism. looking for a hustle. getting into hip hop. I was into punk rock. now i just don't care. difficult to sleep. trying to find a good herb connect. criminal-minded.

oh yeah, one day doing a search for porn, asian guy white girl porn, trying to understand and follow and not feel shameful about a desire whatever it may be. just trying to be free, baby. I found "phuck fu masters", followed a link here and there, and now to here.

there's more though, of course. but can you dig?

love to all y'all
love to the paris rioters

[toml]

^ where in Asia did you go?

[rabidbonobo]

somewhere in e. asia. Don't want to get too specific here. ^^

[dachoi]

I suppose I should introduce myself in some fuller fashion since I am going to be studying the 44 community for the rest of this semester. Why did I become a 44? Well for a variety of reasons but here is the long story for those interested

I am Korean-American (yes I am using the K version rather than the C version - I hope I am not breaking any norms here) and was born in Ohio but my real encounter with my ethnicity when I lived in Spokane, Washington for two years during elementary school. I was relentlessly teased and made fun, which made me painfully aware of racism at an early age. I moved to SF Bay Area in the mid 80's (right when the Asian-American population started to really grow) and experienced culture shock because I was no longer the only Asian kid in school. Pretty much throughout junior high and high school, being Asian meant studying hard, doing the prototypical Asian extracurricular activities like violin, going to Korean school, attending the occasional Korean event. However, I wasn't as "Korean" as many of my fellow students, most of whom were born there and immigrated recently. I guess I was a banana, who looked down at FOBs and at the same time laughed at the "Asian Pride" crowd who seemingly expressed their pride in being Asian through wearing Polo and driving lowered Integras. I became so accustomed to all the Asians around, I am became naive about discrimination, prejudice, and stereotyping that Asian-Americans face. I was happy being the model minority because I didn't know any better.

Like most people, I rediscovered my Asianness in college. While I know many people who say they didn't learn jack in college, I think most people agree you learn more about yourself, which is probably the most valuable thing of all. I started reading, learning, and thereby noticing many of the issues that face Asian Americans today (poor media representation, the AF/WM disparity, model minority stereotype and others). So like many people who have found something new, I sorta went overboard. I called Asian girls who bleached their hair "sell-outs" and went on many an Asian American website/forum to vent my frustration and anger. But like many people, balanced returned and I discovered the difference between intelligent discussion versus intellible ranting. Towards the end of college, I sorta out grew the "Asian American thing" when I noticed that in many of the younger Asian-Americans I met either (1) were militantly pro-Asian American (2) didn't care or (3) did care but didn't feel the need to get worked up about it.

While in college, I found Modelminority.com and became a fairly active member. However, the site has turned into a swarming ground of really militant pro-AM loudmouths who blame CCBs, AFs, Jews, the media, and are so blinded by their misguided pride that they'll endorse anything as long as it somewhat agrees with their views. However, one of the more informed members of that community referred me here where I have been lurking for the past year until now.

[Dialectic]

Whassup dachoi,

Thanks for sharing that with us! Just so you know, I would guess about three members here regularly spell it "Corean" so don't worry about that.

I'm glad you appreciate our sense of perspective here, and we appreciate yours. We'll be making a few more changes for the better in the months to come, and we may even have a surprise or two in store for y'all ....

[Impact-Blue]

I came here to learn about asian issues. I grew up as a banana when I was younger. Growing up in a very domiant cacausian city didn't leave me much time for learning about my identity. Since there were very few asians, I ended up dating white girls mostly. I never thought of this as selling out, but only as seeing that as my only dating option. While in university, I became more aware of the issues surrounding asians. This drove me on to sites like angryasianman.com, goldsea.com, modelminority.com and this one in search of "learning how to be asian".
I think I come for a different background as I hold no prejudice against who anyone dates. I have no patience for racism and prejudice so after seeing that in films and tv, it made me want to be a part of the solution.

[Charlie]

I gotta admit, I was pretty naive until the internet came along and I started reading Asian forums, and after college when I went out into the real world where you see discrimination and subtle racism everywhere. I grew up around a lot of Asians and never felt marginalized before then. I think that for some people who have a hard time keeping things in perspective, it can be a hindrance to be too aware of every little thing, which is found on forums like this.

[elliott20]

I actually never was confronted with racial issues until much later during college, being that I was raised mostly in Taiwan and China for the most part of my life.

So yeah, I was such a FOB when I first came to the States for college. (My accent disguised it though cuz I've been going to international schools since I was 12) And I really didn't know better. But of course, I was in NYU at the time, and NYC is a pretty diverse place to begin with. So even then, the closest I came to being confronted with asian racial issues was watching a bunch of kids in my school go out of their way to declare their asian pride when being asian is something I've done my whole life without a second thought.

then I graduated, and moved to Baltimore for work. Suddenly I'm getting ribbed left and right for being Asian by some of the people living in my area. I'd walk down the street and have some kid give me the good ol' "wong-ching-chong" thing like he was the first kid to ever come up with it. Of course, after I told him that I'd break his arm if he did that again he back down. (Yeah, I know, it's kind of petty but it felt good.) But for the most part, I didn't really put much attention for it.

What brimmed me over and made me upset was when one night I was at a local bar and this guy started giving me a hard time for being Asian. Apparently, he just lost his job because his company outsourced his job to Singapore. Somehow, this became my fault and my burden to bare while this waste of genetic material breathed on me with his alcoholic drench foul mouth.

By this point I had it. I told him if he had a problem with me being Asian, we can talk about this outside over a steel pipe in his skull. His friend walked over and stopped him from walking out while the bartender suggested I leave the bar.

Not once did I receive an apology for this man's behavior nor did anybody came to my aid. It was that night that I started thinking about all the crap I've had to take because of being an Asian in a predominantly low income /diversity area. (Although in truth, baltimore does in fact have an asian population, they're pretty well hidden outside of colleges) Then I started to notice something, being Asian in the US sucks! People take cheap shots about Asians all the time in the media and nothing is ever done about it. I had to work extra hard if I ever want to date somebody that is not Asian because of how the american populace sees us as asexual beings. (At least, outside of NYC it was harder for me)

And then I started spending time reading various sites on the subject and here we are.

Although, I must say, I to this day still have an odd mix of cultural identity between being Asian and Asian American.

[Dialectic]

Thanks for sharing your experiences with us elliott! We've had a few "late-immigrators" on the board in the last few years. We're glad you're here, and we hope you stick around and continue to participate in the discussion!

Some threads are angry, some threads are artsy, some are intellectual, and some are upbeat, so you'll always be able to find someone who can relate to your experiences here.

[taiji]

Well, when i realized the ideals I was brought up with would get me shit in north america.

I guess I realized everything wasn't pretty flowers a long time ago but only started to try changing in the past couple months

I used to study hard. Not go out because my parents had a problem with me leaving the house. Play video games. Do extra math that my parents made me do because getting good marks in school is success in life.

Ok i can be a nice smart asian guy, and get girls... calling for help with their math homework and then making fun of me in the same call. Useless.

Probably the one thing that pushed me over the edge was this one girl (whitewashed asian) that I liked for a long time and was good friends with; hell everywhere we went people thought we were going out (and people who knew us and knew we weren't thought we should), and people also thought I could do better than her - but really it was the other way around. She dated white guys. Then afterwards complained to me about what jackass he was, he lies all the time, he's a loser, at least you're a good friend and you're sincere and funny blah blah shut up bitch.

So by now my parents have pretty much given up on me. I'm only still maintaining a passable mark so that I further my "education" (ie, i have nothing better to do and there's chicks in uni; especailly the FOBs who aren't whitewashed.. yet) but anyway.
I drink. I smoke pot. I work out. I play in bands. I sleep through every class I have.
A whole bunch of non asian things. While it hasn't gotten me anywhere *yet*, at least I have more fun being a twinky then a stereotypical asian. Hey when you can't beat em, join em.

Sorry for the personal anger vent spiel. It's 2:45 in the morning so sorry for ranting. I usually take out my anger in the gym or on my drums but it's 2:45 in the morning and I don't know why I'm still up.

[Dialectic]

Whassup taiji, thanks for sharing a piece of your life with us. A lot of us here can relate to what you're going through, so you're not alone. Welcome to the 44s, and we look forward to more of your posts!

[Infectious]

Probably the one thing that pushed me over the edge was this one girl (whitewashed asian) that I liked for a long time and was good friends with; hell everywhere we went people thought we were going out (and people who knew us and knew we weren't thought we should), and people also thought I could do better than her - but really it was the other way around. She dated white guys. Then afterwards complained to me about what jackass he was, he lies all the time, he's a loser, at least you're a good friend and you're sincere and funny blah blah shut up bitch.

Seriously, the first thing people will tell you to do (okay, the second thing, since most people will tell you to keep on doing what you're doing because eventually it would work) is to say "no" to girls to try to spout off on their abusive boyfriends. Seriously, they have their female friends for support like that.

[Scowl]

I drink. I smoke pot. I work out. I play in bands. I sleep through every class I have. A whole bunch of non asian things.

So did I, when I was in school. I wouldn't call any of those things "non-asian" although I did feel like I had something to prove at the time.

Anyway, welcome aboard.

[bakajyanai]

Since my initial introductory piece details much of my life experience, here is just a basic list of grievances:

1.) Asiaphiles -- a.) I'm not exotic (My name is not Ryu). b.) Don't quite give a damn about J-pop. c.) Your Japanese is ass.
2.) Rice Kings -- Racist douchebags.
3.) Rice Queens -- Racist douchebags with broken gay-dar. Damn Details magazine.
4.) Asians who aspire to be house slaves. I'm cursing them from the fields.
5.) Women who point fingers at me because I am apparrently the manifestation of "evil Asian patriarchy," especially those who state such in front of their white BF. Same hatred applies to white chasing AMs.

[Liang]

I found the 44s through one of those silly asian kid forums like asiansinc...read what you guys stood for, and joined up!

Long live the 44's!

Yeah that's how I got introduced too I think. Ahhh asiansinc...haven't been there in a while. I think I had the record for "Helicopter" in the arcade there too haha.

[LaiSteve66]

When I realized the I lived in a fantasy world where race didn't matter.

[Meltfire Lightspear]

I've battled race problems all my life. But, I'm no ordinary APA.

Tyger Durden asked me what my APA cause is, and I'll answer him in this thread, since this seems to be the thread for that.

I have spent time locked in combat with Whites often, but also, I've had to contend with some East Asians as well, which brings me down to this.

I'm a Fighting 44 that fights for ALL Asian people, and most of all, the Oppressed Peoples of the Asian Nation, namely the darker colored ones and the mixed darker colour ones. I shield my brothas and my sistas(like LMG)against not only their White oppressors outside the fold, but the oppressors in the fold.

I'm sure you're all familar with the Dragon that is in many East Asian mythos. You may also be familiar with St. George, the dragonslayer of legend. I stand to protect my people, the Southerners and the darker Hapa, from the fire and the teeth of the dragon of the East even as it coils tighter around us, seeking to crush our spirit and our minds.

But, unlike the Saint, I choose only to shield and protect. Actively attacking would put me on the same level as those who oppress us. Also, I'm very iberal. I believe strongly in people doing whatever the hell they want, as long as it doesn't infringe on other people's rights.

I am not an aggressor. I serve only to protect, and I do not claim to view myself and ourselves as being free of sin. Neither am I a saint. Only those who directly wish to cause us pain and look down upon us will be served their ass on a plate, to be blunt.

With extra trimmings, too.

I'm a soldier of freedom foremost and a soldier of fortune second. If you want to speak out against other Asian or other darker races, do so. It's your right to speak freely about it, and it's my right to contest you on those grounds.

Asians themselves are colourblind, and I am glad to know that the 44's do not condone this. Their awareness of Colourism is a good thing, a step in the right direction, but there are more steps to be made.

Either fight with me for the uprising of all Asians or seek only to rise above us, defeat your rival opponent and oppress us. It's your call.

I also suggest you listen to "Breaking the Law" by Judas Priest while you read this.

[Cool Intentions]

I'd be a Fighting44 even if I had never met any Asiaphiles personally. The mere thought of some white guy degrading another ethnicity just because they are not cool with themselves is a thorn in my side, and makes me hulk smash to no end.

But in some cases these guys make it personal. When I hear a white guy (or any other race) talk about Asian women as docile, submissive or conservative; I can't help but feel they are insulting my mother... Which to me is a declaration of WAR.

[Millerboy]

While in college, I found Modelminority.com and became a fairly active member. However, the site has turned into a swarming ground of really militant pro-AM loudmouths who blame CCBs, AFs, Jews, the media, and are so blinded by their misguided pride that they'll endorse anything as long as it somewhat agrees with their views. However, one of the more informed members of that community referred me here where I have been lurking for the past year until now.

This is exactly how I found other Asian-American websites such as The Fighting 44s. Someone on ModelMinority.com mentioned Fighting44s to me. I was really pissed off when I saw the ModelMinority forums because I thought the website was okay. They had a good domain name (model minority) and good articles. Then I signed up for their forum and I found a bunch of racist, anti-White, whiny, anti-AF (asian female) people. Every single post they complain about interracial dating disparities. The forum members who constantly use racial slurs for White people and the admin, which is Andrew, doesn't do anything about it. In fact his lack of action implies his acceptance.

They are a form of "Asian Supremacists" that are worse than most White Supremacists!! lol. I'm serious. And there are a few black members who post there too, who don't decry the use of racial slurs, in fact they justify the racism because the "White man" has been oppressing "minorities" for thousands of years, they say. It's ridiculous.

I hope The Fighting 44s doesn't become like that. This is why when I came here, I was so defensive of White people, because modelminority drove me to it. I would've been more pro-Asian if I had found Fighting44s before I found modelminority. This website is 10 times better than mm.

[toml]

They are a form of "Asian Supremacists" that are worse than most White Supremacists!!

Why are they worse then White Supremacists?

[Millerboy]

They are a form of "Asian Supremacists" that are worse than most White Supremacists!!

Why are they worse then White Supremacists?

Because these Asian Supremacists want to kill White men (evidence in their signatures and posts). But they still want to have sex with all sorts of women. While they deny that privilege for Asian females. Why can Asian males have sex with Hispanics, blacks, whites, but Asian females can't?

At least, the White Supremacists are logical in their arguments. They don't allow interracial mating for all White people, not just for White women.

And the Asian Supremacists on modelminority.com use racist slurs towards Whites all the time. Yet there are ZERO racist slurs allowed towards non-Whites, especially not Asians. It's the abundant hypocrisy, and full of hypocrites that turned me off.

They not only want the cake, but they want to eat it too. You gotta share the cake with everyone, of all races and genders. NO DOUBLE STANDARDS.

And I take back my positive recommendation of their articles. Some of their articles are biased in one way, and they use cussing, such as the f-word and others. If a non-Asian male just declares anything positive about Asian female, he is automatically called an Asiaphile, or "cracker" or some racist, derogatory term. It's ridiculous and stupid to a high level.

I thought Asians were supposed to be smart? These Asians are the dumbest people on earth. I have White friends and I'll whoop any Asian guy's ass if he says some racist shit towards my White friends. I'm serious, I don't care if he is Andrew from modelminority.com or Bruce Lee.

Also, Google Directory has labeled modelminority.com as an Asian "Supremacy and Separatism" website: http://directory.google.com/Top/Society/Issues/Race-Ethnic-Religious_Relations/Race_and_Racism/Supremacy_and_Separatism/Asian/

[toml]

^ There are just as many white supremacists who want to kill non-whites but still take their women as well.

Not only are there white supremacists that are like that, but history has shown they have done just that. The colonization of America, Africa, Asia, and other non-white countries is proof.

White supremacists have already done what these so-called Asian supremacists say they want to do.

Now this isn't justification for what these Asian "supremacists" say they want to do--but it gives reason to their anger.

With no cause, there is no effect.

[Millerboy]

^ There are just as many white supremacists who want to kill non-whites but still take their women as well.

Not only are there white supremacists that are like that, but history has shown they have done just that. The colonization of America, Africa, Asia, and other non-white countries is proof.

White supremacists have already done what these so-called Asian supremacists say they want to do.

Now this isn't justification for what these Asian "supremacists" say they want to do--but it gives reason to their anger.

With no cause, there is no effect.

I'm talking about White Supremacists today, not 400 years ago when they colonized the Americas, which was in 1492 when Christopher Columbus discovered the New World. You can't keep on blaming the past on Whites; the fact is that very few Whites today commit any violent crimes. I donít believe in collective guilt for any group of people.

Iím not responsible for the atrocities that Genghis Khan committed, or the Huns and Mongols who raped thousands of White women during the conquest of Eurasia. I am Asian, but Iím not responsible for what the Japanese did in China, the rape of Nanking. I'm sure every race has done horrible things, but we have to look at what people are doing today.

[cattygurl]

I don't consider the numbnuts on MM to be Asian supremacists. They're just supreme dumbasses.

As for debating which supremacists are worse- that's for morons, too. Supremacists are ALL assholes, to a varying degree, but there's no debate on who or what is worse.

White supremacists are obviously more dangerous as they've proven themselves to be so. You really don't see asian supremacist organizations like the KKK- so if you think asian supremacists are WORSE- then you've got yo head in the sand.

[Dialectic]

Millerboy I'm going to say this once and hope it's the end of it.

You have a point. Whites shouldn't have to feel "guilty" about the actions of their ancestors, nor should they have to feel "responsible" for those actions.

We're not talking about something so simple.

We're talking about the economic, social, and political POWER STRUCTURES put into place through those actions, and we're looking at WHO BENEFITS now.

Of course people shouldn't be "racist" against whites. That's not what we're talking about.

We're talking about addressing the INEQUALITY IN POWER and trying to REDISTRIBUTE some of that power in the economic, social, and political spheres.

I got plenty of white friends, none of whom have raped natives, enslaved blacks, or pissed on Asians. They are, however, aware that history has PUT THEM into a PRIVILEGED PLACE OF POWER and given them a WIDE ARRAY OF ADVANTAGES in all spheres, which is UNJUST.

What we're trying to do is address that injustice.

[pirates_of_prowse]

Well, I was born and raised in a small working class town in England where the local population was 99% white, so you can only imagine how things transpired. My only friend btw the ages of 7 - 15 was a half caste Black boy called Alex, who unfortunately, hung himself in March 2001.

All throughout schooling I got beat and harassed daily because I was Asian. My classmates were white and I was yellow, and to me that made no difference, but it did to them. I got held responsible for the killing and imprisoning of their grandfathers in the Second World War, even though I would tell them I wasn't Japanese. If I had a nickel for every time some kid called me a 'Jap' or 'Chink' I’d probably have enough to buy me another planet to live on. I could still remember hearing them chant: "Fight the Jap, kill the jap beat him ‘because the Jap can’t fight the white." I can still remember how my head would grow light and my stomach would twist...

[Dialectic]

Hi PoP, welcome to the 44s, we're glad you found us!

I'm very sorry to hear about your friend, and about your childhood. I myself spent time in Atlanta, Georgia and the Canadian Maritimes when I was quite young, and even on moving to Ottawa, Ontario which was a bigger city, I was a stand-out for a long, long time, so I know what you're talking about.

I've been to the UK, and my father has traveled there several times, and he was warned by a colleague not to go into the pubs in the countryside for fear of racism. It's not easy in North America, and it's even worse in the UK/Europe.

Thanks for sharing a bit of your life with us, and we look forward to hearing more from you.

[pirates_of_prowse]

Thanks for the comments Dialectic.

You know, I've seriously considered the thought of emigrating to North America/Canada, just to be nearer my own people. In 2004, I spent a couple of months living in San Francisco and Los Angeles. The first thing I noticed was the high concentration of Asians living in both cities. I particularly enjoyed talking to the older Asians, and found their naturalised American accents both fascinating and endearing. Experiences like these left a profound affect on me...to some extent, I actually feel a greater affinity with Asian Americans than I do with British Asians. I'm under the impression (illusions?) that AA's, have a stronger sense of racial identity/solidarity, compared to their British counterparts. In the UK, racial assimilation, is a required - if you don't want to risk the chance of being marginalised you better fit in with the white boys, even if it means sacrificing your own personal identity. Being both isolated and few in numbers, most British Asians tend to go down this route. Sadly, my generation, already seem too far gone to change their ways... personally, I'm not mad at them either, because it takes a strong individual to chose the road less travelled -This is the path I've chosen, and will continue to walk, even if it means further alienation.

Before I end this message, I would like to state that I don't hate white people. What I'm against is racism, period, and I think this site promotes the necessary ideals of mutual understanding between the races. However, I do find it upsetting, that some people on here, continue to hold internal prejudices against whites, referring to them as "crackers". Surely, this is self-defeating, and only helps to perpetuate the narrow minded attitudes which we're attempting to overturn. Where I'm from, if you called the wrong guy a cracker, you might end up murdered, or at the very least get beaten up. Racism needs to be eliminated from society. This cannot be achieved with renewed hate. Because when you break it down, our biological differences in skin colour is about as arbitrary as the colour shirt your wearing on your back.

[Dirac]

Hi POP, I'm from England too (Kent).

[atlasien]

"However, I do find it upsetting, that some people on here, continue to hold internal prejudices against whites, referring to them as "crackers"."

Here's my thoughts on that...

I don't think this word necessarily means hostility and prejudice towards individual white people. It is always hostile to whiteness. But I think all people should be hostile to whiteness. To get rid of racism, the white race has to disappear. And I mean that in a positive way that will be psychologically liberating for individual white people. White people can already celebrate their cultural identity in lots of positive ethnic or regional ways (e.g. "I am an American/I am a Southerner/I am an Irish-American") but if they cross the line and celebrate belonging to the white race, that means they celebrate the subjugation of all non-white races. This is what makes "white" a totally different kind of category than "black" or "Asian" or "Hispanic". The concept of "White" is not so much a culture, or an umbrella term for a collection of different cultures... it's more of a racist oppression machine.

I have white ancestors whose culture I guardedly respect, but I would never say "I am proud of my white heritage" :confused: Sometimes it's hard for me to wrap my own head around it.

But I don't like using "cracker". I think in the way it's applied, it's often demeaning to lower-class people. Also it seems misapplied to me... the original word "cracker" used to have a much more specific meaning: white, working-class people from Northern Florida (see this link for a cracker museum! (http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~fcc/main/what's_a_cracker.htm)).

[pirates_of_prowse]

Hi Dirac, nice to know that there are other progressive Asians from the UK in this forum.


Atlasian, you made some good valid points concerning the "cracker" issue. I've actually been called a "cracker" before, by a black dude in downtown San Francisco. He said something along the lines of, "get the hell out of here crackers!" I was with a white friend at the time, so I don't know if the the comment was aimed directly/indirectly at me. I thought it was pretty funny at the time, because I don't look even look white.

I would be hard pressed to call a white person a cracker, unless s/he was being a racist arsehole...there are other alternative words I would
use...such as "round-eye" or "white boy." Believe me, "white boy" really stokes their fire.

[atlasien]

I agree. It's amazing how reminding a white person that they are white has the capacity to shock them!

When people used to ask me variations on "what are you" I used to say I was half Japanese. Then I realized I was supporting the invisible standard of whiteness with my response. About ten years ago I started answering the usual "what are you" question with "I'm half ethnic Japanese and half white". At the "half white" part of my answer, people often flinch a little bit.

[blockthebox]

Welcome, everyone. I am one of the "some people on here" who liberally calls crackers crackers. The context/tone in which I use the word varies, but trust me, it's ALWAYS justified, so get over it.

[silkie]

Well, I was born and raised in a small working class town in England where the local population was 99% white, so you can only imagine how things transpired. My only friend btw the ages of 7 - 15 was a half caste Black boy called Alex, who unfortunately, hung himself in March 2001.

All throughout schooling I got beat and harassed daily because I was Asian. My classmates were white and I was yellow, and to me that made no difference, but it did to them. I got held responsible for the killing and imprisoning of their grandfathers in the Second World War, even though I would tell them I wasn't Japanese. If I had a nickel for every time some kid called me a 'Jap' or 'Chink' I’d probably have enough to buy me another planet to live on. I could still remember hearing them chant: "Fight the Jap, kill the jap beat him ‘because the Jap can’t fight the white." I can still remember how my head would grow light and my stomach would twist...


Sorry for the delay prowse, but welcome.
Thank you for sharing your experiences with us. I completely know where you come from, and although I consider myself a pretty well adjusted adult, anything that reminds me of these episodes often sends me into a flying rage.

[Synthetic]

i think i got attracted to this site because about...err....three years ago i was living with 3 other people....one being an asian woman who disliked asian men and had a white boyfriend, and another being a white dude with an asian girlfriend....(though they broke up and now she's my girlfriend)...crazy world.

well, i was also very interested in personal, journalistic, styles of writing and it just so happened that by the hands of "fate" i found this site....

and at first, it seemed very catered to what i was feeling about the world in general, but as i stayed a bit longer here, i realized that being extremely mad/depressed/vocal about everything doesn't really accomplish anything and my views began to stray from SEVERAL other members....i kinda calmed down and took a more accepting and apathetic approach to the world whereas it seemed others on this board were only getting more mad, more irrational, and more upset with everything...

i couldn't put up with the depressing and pissed off nature of these members anymore because their attitudes were only making me more mad at them rather than at the real issues.

so i left....

and then, maybe a month ago, i stopped by again and began to read some of the newer posts and realized that all of the lame asses seemed to have migrated to other ponds....

and now i'm back with a more mature crowd (or so it appears)...

and now that i've said that, i'm certain it'll go back to the way it was.

[pirates_of_prowse]

Hi Silkie, don't worry about it, I think alot of Chinese kids in Britain have a similar story to tell. It's not all bad, at least I had the opportunity to engage these racist idiots by fighting them. Some people don't even get that chance.


Welcome, everyone. I am one of the "some people on here" who liberally calls crackers crackers. The context/tone in which I use the word varies, but trust me, it's ALWAYS justified, so get over it.


BTB, what's with the animosity? If you insist on calling white people crackers, then you shouldn't object to white people using words like chink or nig nog. Wouldn't it be smarter to say you're going to shoot a man for what he is doing to you than because he is white? If you attack him because he is white, you give him no way out. He can't stop being white. We've got to give white people a chance. They probably won't take it, but we've got to give them a chance.

The way I see things, it's silly for a person to be placed, or allow himself to be placed in the position of a racist. It's not wise and intelligent for a person to take the position of a racist, because you can't defend it. And this is true. You can't take a racist position and defend it, you don't have anything to base it on.

I don't care what a person looks like or where they come from. I leave my mind wide open to anybody who is willing to help get the monkey off our backs, white or otherwise.

Now you're really going to label me a banana for writing this.

[blockthebox]

Listen, I'm not trying to be an asshole - it just comes naturally. And I'm tired of having to repeatedly explain my position on things like crackers and white privilege and why rhubarb pie is disgusting, so I won't. Have fun posting and perhaps we can butt heads again in another thread.

[lopan]

and now that i've said that, i'm certain it'll go back to the way it was.

Don't jinx us! We've made a concerted effort to change the 44s for the better.

[maogirl]

Now you're really going to label me a banana for writing this.

no, dude, you're a banana because you want to move to a majority white population in order to be closer to "your kind?"

wtf?

cracker cracker cracker cracker...makes my skin glow and my hair shiny to say that, and you have a lot of learning to do when it comes to white privilege and systematic racism.

[pirates_of_prowse]

I know all about systematic racism, having grown up in a town full of rednecks.

In England, Asian people are isolated. Aside from the Chinatown enclaves, there's no such thing as an Asian community. When I was in LA and San Francisco, everywhere I went there were Asians. Whole communities full of Asians who spoke English. Unfortunately I can't speak Chinese, so naturally, if I was to live in China or Hong Kong, I'd feel very isolated because I can't communicate back. Being nearer my own kind, for me, this means living in a community of Asians, who speak the only language I understand, which unfortunately, happens to be English.

I wasn't intending to get into a debate over crackers, or expecting such an onslaught. I came here to make friends, not enemies. I might not agree with people on certain things, but that's okay. We're all Asian, and we share that common bond.

[pirates_of_prowse]

I would also like to state that I'm not a banana, not even close. I've gone out of my way to defend Asians whenever the occasion arose.

[lopan]

Unfortunately I can't speak Chinese, so naturally, if I was to live in China or Hong Kong, I'd feel very isolated because I can't communicate back.

I know how you feel on that one. It took me a long time to get to where i am with my Cantonese fluency, and even still it's fairly bad. I did immerse myself in HK for a year -- i was able to get by for the most part with English, but once i was in the city living on my own; you'll find that you'll pick things up VERY quickly.

I know that this wasn't the point you were trying to make and that i'm digressing completely. But anyway, if you ever decide you want to be adventurous and pick up and move to China or HK, don't let the language barrier stop you. Human beings are remarkably flexible when they're challenged, and you'll find that picking up Cantonese will be much easier than you thought. It'll be a fantastic experience if you ever do go for an extended period of time.

[lopan]

I would also like to state that I'm not a banana, not even close. I've gone out of my way to defend Asians whenever the occasion arose.

Don't mind MaoGirl. She's got a love/hate (well, mostly hate) relationship with bananas, in paritcular Asian American men. Good thing I'm Asian Canadian (although I don't think that's all that much better in her books...)!

This board's really sensitive to issues of white priviledge. Make sure to read up on it well before you decide to defend it.

[Dialectic]

It's all love with mg, it's all love. The thing with SE Asian chicks is they can only express it through swearing and contempt and bile :P

[evil_FUX]

It's all love with mg, it's all love. The thing with SE Asian chicks is they can only express it through swearing and contempt and bile :P

That does sound about right. :D

[Heyyu]

Ok, I guess I'll post my reasons since it's kinda funny. I actually came upon this site from a link in another forum (NOT another Asian site). I was actually browsing toon zone forums... yes, I was browsing a frickin' cartoon site of all things when I came upon this site. So whoever posted on toonzone, I have you to thank.

Anyways, this site was one of my first introductions to the "Azn" experience. Well, like many on here, I had already had some observations and theories from previous experiences, but I think it was when I came to this site that the awareness of what was happening all came together.

[maogirl]

It's all love with mg, it's all love. The thing with SE Asian chicks is they can only express it through swearing and contempt and bile :P

curses, the jig is up!

but seriously, i don't got beef with you all anymore. it's hk men who are driving me insane now with their fucking dimples and lovely brown bodies and complicated natures.

[JadeDragon]

The thing with SE Asian chicks is they can only express it through swearing and contempt and bile :P

I hear that it makes for GREAT make-up sex. :p Not that I know about it, because I'm an innocent little girl...

[Dialectic]

I heard it ends up with fingernail scrapes across the face and a "conversation" with a bunch of complicated brown guys in an alley!

[maogirl]

dimples! don't forget the dimples!

[pirates_of_prowse]

I can speak a little Hakka, due to my upbringing. I didn't learn English until I was 6- couldn't even answer back, during the teachers morning name call. So, in theory, my first language is Hakka.

I read up on White priviledge, and I agree with all the points stated. Currently, I'm embarking on a major project, called The United Asian Front, which deals specifically towards organising Asian self defence groups dedicated to protecting and defending Asian businesses and Asian citizens who have been the victims of assault and harassment by the local white population. Race-related violence is a big problem in the UK. And it's not going to go away unless somebody puts an end to it. The British Government, has shown, time and time again, that racial assault, perpetrated by the White population, is not a widespread problem. But it is, and I have enough newspaper clippings to prove it.

I will disclose more information, about the United Asian Front in a later post.

[pirates_of_prowse]

[QUOTE=pirates_of_prowse;19495]Currently, I'm embarking on a major project, called The United Asian Front, which deals specifically towards organising Asian self defence groups dedicated to protecting and defending Asian businesses and Asian citizens who have been the victims of assault and harassment by the local white population. Race-related violence is a big problem in the UK. And it's not going to go away unless somebody puts an end to it. The British Government, has shown, time and time again, that racial assault, perpetrated by the White population, is not a widespread problem. But it is, and I have enough newspaper clippings to prove it.
QUOTE]



Just to remind people, the United Asian Front is not a protection racket. We provide free services for all those who need it. I'm often left wondering, why the Chinese Triads, never do anything, when it comes to protecting the livelihood of Asian people living in England. I posed this question to my uncle- he holds a pretty high position in the British 14K, and this is what he told me: "the triads only care about taking money from the Chinese, not helping them." I don't understand how such a powerful organisation, like the triads, can go about leaching of their own community and then turn a blind eye to the racist violence which is being committed, on a daily level, against our people. These motherfuckers stand around doing nothing, whilst some white brutes go about firebombing a Chinese take-out in Birmingham. To me, the triads are bullshit.

In the past month, there has been a string of race-related incidents in my hometown. Below, I have attached a photo of the latest unprovoked attack on a Indian restaurant. The guy who owns the store, Mr. Ahmed, is a decent, hardworking man. And I told him, if he gets anymore trouble from these racist morons, he has the full backing of the United Asian Front to call upon. In fact, I advised Mr. Ahmed to put up a placard, at the front of his store, which reads, "Protected by the United Asian Front." The message we are sending, is that, anyone who commits violence against our people, will be met with extreme physical harm. This is the duty of the United Asian Front - to protect and serve with armed self defence.

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s51/irnvist/racist.jpg

[Scowl]

I'm often left wondering, why the Chinese Triads, never do anything, when it comes to protecting the livelihood of Asian people living in England. I posed this question to my uncle- he holds a pretty high position in the British 14K, and this is what he told me: "the triads only care about taking money from the Chinese, not helping them." I don't understand how such a powerful organisation, like the triads, can go about leaching of their own community and then turn a blind eye to the racist violence which is being committed, on a daily level, against our people.

Well, your uncle said it. I mean, what do you expect from a criminal organization?

Speaking of, you know the United Asian Front doesn't sound like a completely law abiding group, either. Did you get a lot of people together, or is it only a few guys?

[blockthebox]

Is it like the Guardian Angels? My initial opinion is that something like this sounds good in theory (and as far as I know it isn't something that's ever been executed on a larger scale) but I wonder about people stepping beyond certain boundaries (legal/moral) and the organization itself being perceived as racist vigilantism. Anyway, if you want to talk about this in depth, feel free to start a thread about it. Maybe I'll split this off later ...

[Dialectic]

Just be careful, Prowse! There's risk not just with thugs, but with law enforcement. But your effort is awesome.

Incidentally, the way the triads behave with regard to their own communities is actually the way all mafias behave, and is fairly well studied. Russian, Italian, Sri Lankan, Vietnamese, Jamaican, American Black, Latino, etc. all prey on their own communities for money: they do the opposite of what romantic notions of these organizations lead us to believe they do. They exploit the weakness and segregation of their own people, and their interests are actually in direct conflict with racial integration, harmony, and prosperity.

Whereas some people like to think that these people stand for their "race" and have a sense of racial pride (which they do, in their way), they're actually at a level below that: these guys act like tribes and early feudal organizations: they forage for resources, threaten and kill anyone who is not extended "family," produce almost nothing by themselves, and at "best" (the most sophisticated guys, the criminal organizations, i.e. early feudal) engage in systemic illegal activity, like gambling, money laundering, protection rackets, prostitution, gun-running, and drug dealing (rather than things like armed robbery and theft, which they still of course do). These people do nothing to help any sort of "cause" and should never be approached for any sort of "help" on any level, barring total desperation.

We had a great guy on this set a while ago who was a low-level member of a Viet "set" in Boston. He respected their intense loyalty to one another and how they would violently defend themselves against injustices by outsiders. What he didn't mention, however, and might not have seen that much of, is what Viets do to their own people, the ones not in your set.

[pirates_of_prowse]

Well, your uncle said it. I mean, what do you expect from a criminal organization?

Speaking of, you know the United Asian Front doesn't sound like a completely law abiding group, either. Did you get a lot of people together, or is it only a few guys?


Well, so far, I've managed to get 9 guys involved in our struggle. We're not a criminal organisation, and since the local authorities have shown, that they are not willing to do anything but talk, we feel that it is only right to take matters into our own hands. We believe that we have the right to do what is necessary to bring an end to that situation, and it doesn't mean that we advocate violence, but at the same time we are not against using violence in self-defense. I don't even call it violence when it's self-defense, I call it intelligence

Is it like the Guardian Angels? My initial opinion is that something like this sounds good in theory (and as far as I know it isn't something that's ever been executed on a larger scale) but I wonder about people stepping beyond certain boundaries (legal/moral) and the organization itself being perceived as racist vigilantism. Anyway, if you want to talk about this in depth, feel free to start a thread about it. Maybe I'll split this off later ...

Hi BTB. You can say that our organisation is a spin of the Guardian Angels. I feel that what we are doing, is completely justifiable. The Government can say whatever they want about the organisation being a vigilante hate group. If we react to white racism with a violent reaction, to me that's not racism. The British National Front is racism - but our reaction has nothing to do with racism. Our reaction is the natural reaction of a human being, reacting to defend himself and protect himself from narrow minded thugs.

I'll discuss more about this issue in a latter post.

[poisenedrice]

*light bulb*

Here's what you gotta do. Do to those Redcoat limey bastards what they did to us: sell them drugs and get them high. It doesn't have to be hard ish like coke, just the minor stuff like pot or whatever you guys sniff/snort/smoke/inject over there. That way, you can destroy their communities AND have cash to buy the weapons to beat down their imperial asses.

And change the name of your group to something mysterious and intimidating like "Fukinese Dragons" or "Hakka Tigers" or some shit.

Goddamn I'm a genius. Just kidding, I'm crazy.

[maogirl]

And change the name of your group to something mysterious and intimidating like "Fukinese Dragons" or "Hakka Tigers" or some shit.

Goddamn I'm a genius. Just kidding, I'm crazy.

dude, are you teasing me???

i'm a tiger and he's a dragon, so that would make me a fukienese tiger and him the hakka dragon :P

fucking hakkas and your [censored]

[poisenedrice]

dude, are you teasing me???

i'm a tiger and he's a dragon, so that would make me a fukienese tiger and him the hakka dragon :P

fucking hakkas and your [censored]

C'mon now, you know I am only 1/4. But OK, since I am a rooster, how about Hakka cocks?

Oh wait...

[pirates_of_prowse]

*light bulb*

Here's what you gotta do. Do to those Redcoat limey bastards what they did to us: sell them drugs and get them high. It doesn't have to be hard ish like coke, just the minor stuff like pot or whatever you guys sniff/snort/smoke/inject over there. That way, you can destroy their communities AND have cash to buy the weapons to beat down their imperial asses.



My friend used the same logic about dealing to a community which wasn't his. And now he's doing six years in prison. Round my end, you'll find that most of the dealers are Black and Pakistani kids, who wouldn't think twice about getting the white community hooked on junk.You could call this justice in the making, but it's going to take another 200 million dope fiends, before the Chinese are on equal footing with the British.


And change the name of your group to something mysterious and intimidating like "Fukinese Dragons" or "Hakka Tigers" or some shit..

Changing the name of the group would actually be a good idea. We don't want to generate any negative publicity. So, I'm deciding on a more conservative, moderate sounding name. Apart from that, the original philosophies remain the same.

[pirates_of_prowse]

Would just like to state that we've managed to increase the group to a dozen members. Now, I know this doesn't sound much, but the guys who joined last week, both work in the legal profession. With their knowledge, we have the necessary organisational skill to turn this into a credible, and recognised force.

[theme]

What made me a fighting44?

I heard that if I signed up I would get free merchandise. I was bamboozled.

[Dialectic]

Would just like to state that we've managed to increase the group to a dozen members. Now, I know this doesn't sound much, but the guys who joined last week, both work in the legal profession. With their knowledge, we have the necessary organisational skill to turn this into a credible, and recognised force.

That's terrific news.

Haha, Theme, we promised nothing! Except our love.

[Lum]

Not sure I even know where to begin, and if I were to give you every gory detail I'd probably end up with tendonitis.

My childhood effectively began in Queens NY in the mid-seventies. Our neighborhood was fairly mixed back then and somehow the world seemed like a more threatening place than it is now. Walking home from school was like navigating the Gaza Strip with all the wandering bullies, gangs and deviants, and this wasn't even the ghetto. Throughout those years I was beaten up, pushed around, spat on and called racist names on a regular basis by just about every color in a bag of Skittles. Some of these kids were two to four times my age, which seems so ridiculous now. Who the hell beats up a five-year old? But I survived, went to public school, made friends and things got a little better. I still dealt with race-hatred from time to time, but at least I wasn't alone.

One day in the seventh grade I stood at the end of the lunch line and this kid Mike who fancied himself the first Jewish Nazi decided he should have his lunch ahead of me. Again, I was last in line, meaning his victory would have made him second to last. So he screams, "Get the fuck out of my way you stupid fucking CHINK!" right in my face. I don't know what came over me, but before I knew it I had kicked him as hard as I could, square in the nuts, which sent him running to the bathroom. I thought, "This is it. I'm dead", but instead of a lynching I heard someone bust out laughing. It was his best friend Adam, who had been just barely tolerating Mike's assinine phases for years. Adam stood up, marched over and gingerly shook my hand and said "Mike said his balls were bleeding!" He was laughing so hard tears were streaming down his face. Adding insult to injury was the fact that now Mike would every day have to eat his lunch next to me, like our idiot mascot, for the next four years.

And that was that. Having discovered I could make allies to protect me, I became a holy terror of wit and charm. The class clown. Bart Simpson. However my constant outbursts and attempts to break the stereotype of the smart quiet Asian made my grades go down the toilet, and as you can guess my parents went ballistic. Little did they know my rebellion was just getting started.

Things got a lot more serious, as they usually do, during the teenage years. I fought with my brother, dropped out of school, disappeared for days at a time, brought home a string of bad-girls, smoked, drank, vandalised and did drugs. And the more my folks would try to discipline me the more I proved myself immune. I jumped from one circle to the next looking for a surrogate family of sorts. Metalheads, rappers, hippies, anarchists, graffiti-artists; you name it and I hung with them all. Likewise my opinions swung like a pendulum. One day I hated blacks, the next it was Jews, homosexuals, whites, Asians and on and on. I'm not proud of any of that.

Eventually I seemed to settle in with some radical hippie-types and for a time felt downright accepted, but little by little I began to discover a sneakier, more subtle brand of racism that seemed more like an inherent hypocrisy in people, and off I went once again. This time my adventures took me around 48 states and then here, to the 49th. More than fifteen years have gone by in this cold and dark place, and during that time I've tried to come to terms with things I've said and done, get to know my culture and its history and make peace with my family. I've also tried to leave several times, sometimes because I miss Haw Flakes and sometimes because I get to feeling like such an outsider here, but for one reason or another I keep coming back. As I get older it's harder to change habits and surroundings, not to mention the fact that my body is starting that rebellion of its own for how I've treated it.

I've made some wonderful friends here that are very tolerant of my occasional rants, but I get tired of prefacing everything I say with a disclaimer or an explanation of some kind. So I looked to the internet hoping to hear from people who perhaps look and feel as I do. This took me to Asian-Nation, but there were so many trolls there and I'm not looking to round-table with a bunch of "oppressed" Jew-hating white guys that happen to like sushi. I went to FWAAM and it was a lot of fun but I'm not looking for pen-pals. I went to Model Minority but found that my email address was banned [Edit:see kimtae's reply] Then I came here to the Fighting 44s and it was all smart and hardcore and countercultureish and pissed-off in all the right places, just like me. XD

I did try to make this shorter but you asked a question that begs a long answer, and hence shall I spew.

[lopan]

Wow, Lum. You have a fantastic story. Thanks for sharing that.

[Scowl]

Changing the name of the group would actually be a good idea. We don't want to generate any negative publicity. So, I'm deciding on a more conservative, moderate sounding name. Apart from that, the original philosophies remain the same.

Yeah, seriously. "United Asian Front" sounds like either a hate group/gang or a rebellion. Something innocuous like [Local community name] Asian Association or something like that would be perfect. Hell, over here biker gangs call themselves "Motorcycle Clubs."

[Lum]

Yeah, seriously. "United Asian Front" sounds like either a hate group/gang or a rebellion. Something innocuous like [Local community name] Asian Association or something like that would be perfect. Hell, over here biker gangs call themselves "Motorcycle Clubs."

I agree UAF=yikes! Sounds very people's militia. That and it's the same acronym for the university up here. LOL. You're not going for an all-out war I take it, but you are talking about physically defending people and you'll have to strike a balance I suppose. Look at the JDL...those guys have been kicking ass and taking names for years, and nobody can seem to touch them.

One thing any group like this needs though, even more than muscle, is a really hotshit lawyer. Hatecrime will not decrease if the perpetrators are regularly getting a slap on the wrist for their actions, and sometimes a good lawyer can be a terrifying thing, at least over here. Also might be good to perform some acts of goodwill for the community at large in your downtime; like a starting a community center or offering some kind of free secondary education. And if the newspapers don't eat that shit up, by all means start your own. I imagine there are tons of non-Asian people around that are on the fence or turn a blind eye when one of us gets attacked and you need their support as well. If you decrease the popularity of racism and show people how the world benefits from diversity, things will start to get better. Just floating some ideas; I really have no idea how these things work in the UK.

Talk about fighting the good fight though...you're taking it to the streets and for that, prowse, my hat goes off to you.

[Dialectic]

Those are some good ideas, Lum. Also, thanks for sharing a bit of your life with us above. I'm glad to hear things turned out all right. You're in Alaska, right? You oughtta fly down to at least Vancouver every once in a while to get your Haw flakes and beef noodles!

[ellencho]

Dang it! I thought Lum was mm.com Lum but mm.com Lum is on the east coast and barely legal.

[kimtae]

Lum, MM.com bans most public and free e-mail addresses like Yahoo Hotmail and Google so it's not personal. But hey, you're better off here anyway. Check out their frontpage stuff for some interesting articles but otherwise you probably don't need more hate filled diatribes against AF's and Jews so welcome to the 44's instead. The only diatribes we have here are against each other, just kidding.

[Lum]

Ohhh....that makes perfect sense, because I've only ever used those web-based addresses. I'd still rather be here but thanks for clearing that up.

Barely Legal Lum? I've never seen that one hehe. Oh well, I knew that name would prove a bit generic, and kinda female, but it's part of the name my dad gave me so it made sense at the time.

Dialectic, you live in a truly beautiful city and one I've considered moving to but it never came to fruition. Still it is an integral part of the drive down the Alcan which I've done three times and it never ceases to take my breath away. Everybody should make that trip at least once in a lifetime. Got a package from my sister today and there were Haw Flakes in there. Woot!

[ellencho]

Barely Legal Lum? I've never seen that one hehe. Oh well, I knew that name would prove a bit generic, and kinda female, but it's part of the name my dad gave me so it made sense at the time.


Actually Lum was a guy and he was 10 years younger than me. That's why I referred to him as barely legal.

[Lum]

Actually Lum was a guy and he was 10 years younger than me. That's why I referred to him as barely legal.

Really I'm glad to hear that (that Lum is male I mean). Although it doesn't appear on my birth certificate, the name always reminded me of the old anime "Lum", wherein Lum was a teenage girl from another planet. Plus my dad once said it's sometimes a girl's name in China and I was like WTF??! But I got over it.

[27727746]

I would like to preface my comments with a brief personal history. I spent the majority of my life in a small town in Iowa. My mother and I were among the very few non-white people living in this town whose population was around 3,000. I was rarely made to feel different because of my ethnicity. It is important for you to realize that my feelings do not stem from bitterness over personal experiences. It need not happen to me before I realize what is happening to non-whites around the world. The following are a few of the revelations that have shaped my thinking.

1. When I realized that all non-white countries (excluding Japan) were in the third world. How could this be? There was such a disparity between white and non-white. Was it just the luck of the draw? Was it that we are not as smart as they are? Is it that we do not work as hard as they do? (age 16, summer of 1991)

2. When I noticed that there were hundreds of websites that advocated white supremacy but not one that espoused African, Arabian, Asian, or Hispanic superiority. Why is it that so many whites feel this way yet very few non-whites seem to posess this kind of reprehensible thought process? (age 27, January of 2003)

3. After visiting several websites dealing with the topic of rape in which people were recommending targeting asian women. A) Saying that it would be physically easier because they are smaller. B) Because next to Arabian women, Asian women were the least likely to report a rape. Do not read into my having gone to these websites. (age 29, summer of 2004)

4. After a friend of mine who works for the government told me that there are groups within American and British intelligence whose primary function is to initiate a non-nuclear conflict between China and India (the two biggest threats to America and the European Union). This would serve as a way to slow their momentum in becoming economic and military powers. They use words like non-nuclear so they can sleep at night but as anyone can imagine it is highly likely that a military action between China and India would escalate into a nuclear conflict. (age 30, fall of 2005)

5. After reading Guns, Germs, and Steel, and Confessions of an Economic Hitman. These two books pushed me beyond the point of no return. There was no turning back, I had finally found my purpose in life. (age 31, late summer early fall of 2006)

[.:hanbox3r]

Surprisingly, my Asian identity never came into crisis until I moved to the supposed cultural center of the world, Canada. I had previously lived in America prior.

Granted, I do live in a white suburb in Canada, but the white suburbs I lived in while residing in America had no discrimination whatsoever.

My first instance of discrimination, I remember, was a little white kid with freckles, doing the classic "me chinese" song. So, I punched him in the face. Got in trouble with the principal, got in trouble at home, but I still felt good. I don't know why I punched him, but I know had I just stood there and took it, I would've become a whitewashed Asian like so many of my other friends who just tolerate their crap. The rest of grade school pretty much went easy from there on.

It was high school that really made me aware of just how deep this had run. It started with the "smart" stereotypes. Yes, I will admit, I am a fairly smart person. But it's not because I'm Asian - it's because I am intelligent and work hard. Yet everyone who saw me, without even for one second talking to me, came right up to me and said "OMG, you're so smart, I wish I was like you, how do you do it" in the most patronizing tone I've ever heard in my life. It was like I was some kind of guru or genie they could just rub at will to ask for help. I, being the nice guy, would always help them, and I suppose in retrospect I should have just told them to suck it. What I did, instead, however, was try to break this stereotype through my actions. I joined the football team, I started boxing (best choice I ever made), had a few flings with girls from all ethnicities, and did a whole plethora of sports, all the while still hanging out with the few Asian friends I still had who had not ditched me to go to keg parties and get high.

No such luck. The stereotype stuck. Soon, as people started hitting puberty and getting insecure, they also started dropping the sexual stereotypes. I had an Asian friend who actually played along with them, and I just felt like kicking the crap out of him. All the Asian girls I knew were dating white guys (I would have no problem with this, except for the fact four of them dumped their previous Asian boyfriends and then almost immediately went to the white guy afterwards). I got the point where I was so sick of this stereotyping, subtle discrimination, that I just started to get anti-social. I would take every opportunity to belittle those who discriminated against me, all the while trying to promote positive images of Asians. The thing that hurt me the most was, when I would bring up this conversation with a fellow Asian, they would just scoff and laugh, as if it didn't exist. So I needed to find some who actually DID care. And here I am now, a wannabe fighting44.

[lopan]

277 and Hanboxer, thanks for sharing your stories! The majority of us here went through the same process/ realizations as yourselves. Glad you found this place, cuz the 44s was built for people like you!

Look forward to reading more of your thoughts.

[Dialectic]

I would like to preface my comments with a brief personal history. I spent the majority of my life in a small town in Iowa. My mother and I were among the very few non-white people living in this town whose population was around 3,000. I was rarely made to feel different because of my ethnicity. It is important for you to realize that my feelings do not stem from bitterness over personal experiences. It need not happen to me before I realize what is happening to non-whites around the world. The following are a few of the revelations that have shaped my thinking.

1. When I realized that all non-white countries (excluding Japan) were in the third world. How could this be? There was such a disparity between white and non-white. Was it just the luck of the draw? Was it that we are not as smart as they are? Is it that we do not work as hard as they do? (age 16, summer of 1991)

2. When I noticed that there were hundreds of websites that advocated white supremacy but not one that espoused African, Arabian, Asian, or Hispanic superiority. Why is it that so many whites feel this way yet very few non-whites seem to posess this kind of reprehensible thought process? (age 27, January of 2003)

3. After visiting several websites dealing with the topic of rape in which people were recommending targeting asian women. A) Saying that it would be physically easier because they are smaller. B) Because next to Arabian women, Asian women were the least likely to report a rape. Do not read into my having gone to these websites. (age 29, summer of 2004)

4. After a friend of mine who works for the government told me that there are groups within American and British intelligence whose primary function is to initiate a non-nuclear conflict between China and India (the two biggest threats to America and the European Union). This would serve as a way to slow their momentum in becoming economic and military powers. They use words like non-nuclear so they can sleep at night but as anyone can imagine it is highly likely that a military action between China and India would escalate into a nuclear conflict. (age 30, fall of 2005)

5. After reading Guns, Germs, and Steel, and Confessions of an Economic Hitman. These two books pushed me beyond the point of no return. There was no turning back, I had finally found my purpose in life. (age 31, late summer early fall of 2006)

Thanks very much for introducing yourself, and for sharing a bit of your life with us!

With regard to point (4), I have no doubt they're trying what they can to destabilize relations, not only between China and India, but between all the Asian powers. I suppose our one hope is that if we know the U.S. government is doing it, then the Asian governments know, too.

With regard to point (5), I have Diamond's book but have only read bits (I haven't had the time to sit down with it yet). As I understand what I've read so far and discussed with friends, he presents an excellent analysis of the formation of human societies at the early stages of development, where geography and physical circumstances are the primary determinants of development; rest assured, however, that when societies reach autonomous self-reflective stages, they have much more of a say in their development than when they were not so self-reflective (which has been the case with most of history).

[Dialectic]

Surprisingly, my Asian identity never came into crisis until I moved to the supposed cultural center of the world, Canada. I had previously lived in America prior.

Granted, I do live in a white suburb in Canada, but the white suburbs I lived in while residing in America had no discrimination whatsoever.

My first instance of discrimination, I remember, was a little white kid with freckles, doing the classic "me chinese" song. So, I punched him in the face. Got in trouble with the principal, got in trouble at home, but I still felt good. I don't know why I punched him, but I know had I just stood there and took it, I would've become a whitewashed Asian like so many of my other friends who just tolerate their crap. The rest of grade school pretty much went easy from there on.

It was high school that really made me aware of just how deep this had run. It started with the "smart" stereotypes. Yes, I will admit, I am a fairly smart person. But it's not because I'm Asian - it's because I am intelligent and work hard. Yet everyone who saw me, without even for one second talking to me, came right up to me and said "OMG, you're so smart, I wish I was like you, how do you do it" in the most patronizing tone I've ever heard in my life. It was like I was some kind of guru or genie they could just rub at will to ask for help. I, being the nice guy, would always help them, and I suppose in retrospect I should have just told them to suck it. What I did, instead, however, was try to break this stereotype through my actions. I joined the football team, I started boxing (best choice I ever made), had a few flings with girls from all ethnicities, and did a whole plethora of sports, all the while still hanging out with the few Asian friends I still had who had not ditched me to go to keg parties and get high.

No such luck. The stereotype stuck. Soon, as people started hitting puberty and getting insecure, they also started dropping the sexual stereotypes. I had an Asian friend who actually played along with them, and I just felt like kicking the crap out of him. All the Asian girls I knew were dating white guys (I would have no problem with this, except for the fact four of them dumped their previous Asian boyfriends and then almost immediately went to the white guy afterwards). I got the point where I was so sick of this stereotyping, subtle discrimination, that I just started to get anti-social. I would take every opportunity to belittle those who discriminated against me, all the while trying to promote positive images of Asians. The thing that hurt me the most was, when I would bring up this conversation with a fellow Asian, they would just scoff and laugh, as if it didn't exist. So I needed to find some who actually DID care. And here I am now, a wannabe fighting44.

Thanks very much for introducing yourself and sharing that about yourself. All the 44 Founders are in Canada as well. If you're interested in reading a terrific novel about the Asian-Canadian male experience, you must read Banana Boys by Terry Woo, which takes place in Toronto, Ottawa, Waterloo, and Sarnia.

http://www.amazon.ca/Banana-Boys-Terry-Woo/dp/1896332218/ref=sr_1_2/701-2946545-7105934?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1182922742&sr=8-2

Oh and you guys found the right place. This site was built for you, because we built it for us, and you were always us.

[cattygurl]

"Guns, Germs, and Steel, and Confessions of an Economic Hitman"

I have this book somewhere but it managed to fall through the cracks. Thanks for reminding me, i'll have to go find it now.

Good to see everyone new here. I'm the resident crazy cat/dog lady.

[minbo]

Just a note about "Guns Germs and Steel"... Many people take everything written there as Jared speaking or meaning Gospel. He does not mean it as such, he prefaces that the subject is complex and he is just summarizing the best and most consistent viewpoints on the material. He is open to being wrong and open to hearing different ideas. That said, I think that he does put forward a compelling "big picture' and supports his points well. As he is summarizing, sometimes you might dispute individual "facts", but bearing in mind that they are summary arguments, you should not get too twisted and hung up on every little detail. One that I remember disagreeing with was his thoughts on why some geographic areas unified early politically and others didn't vis a vis China and Europe.

If you get a chance to read Collapse, The Third Chimpanzee and Why is Sex Fun, I recommend those as well.

[atlasien]

I've read almost all of Diamond's books. His perspective is refreshingly honest.

I find it very common that when discussing history with white people -- or people who refuse to question European hegemony, in general -- they will start saying things like "well, the Iroquois tortured people" or "the Mongols were mean, too". You just have to give up any hope for a serious discussion at that point. Yes, in an upside-down universe we'd have Mongol-Aztec-Bantu hegemony suppressing an impoverished European minority. But why is necessary to establish that we're not living in a science fiction novel in order to have a discussion.

[cattygurl]

We should create a booklist thread. In fact, i'll go and do it right now!