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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;The Democrats will lose in November&#8221;</title>
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	<link>http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/</link>
	<description>Uniting the Asian Conscience</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 17 May 2012 23:55:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: minorTruths</title>
		<link>http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7293</link>
		<dc:creator>minorTruths</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 Aug 2008 02:58:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7293</guid>
		<description>I have taken a few ethics classes in time, so I recognize your points in regards to Utilitarianism vs. Absolute moral virtues and all that jazz.  I think I alluded to it in my post.  But what I was really trying to say was that wouldn’t it be nice if Obama can win as a candidate who kept much of his character intact  and did not have to resort to “unethical” tactics that’s anywhere near the same level as Republicans and past presidential campaigns.  That would be ultimate triumph of ‘good’ over ‘evil’.   I was just saying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have taken a few ethics classes in time, so I recognize your points in regards to Utilitarianism vs. Absolute moral virtues and all that jazz.  I think I alluded to it in my post.  But what I was really trying to say was that wouldn’t it be nice if Obama can win as a candidate who kept much of his character intact  and did not have to resort to “unethical” tactics that’s anywhere near the same level as Republicans and past presidential campaigns.  That would be ultimate triumph of ‘good’ over ‘evil’.   I was just saying.</p>
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		<title>By: Dialectic</title>
		<link>http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7291</link>
		<dc:creator>Dialectic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 Aug 2008 02:26:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7291</guid>
		<description>I don't think I implied that marketing is a simple thing, but I do think it's an obvious point that it's all about marketing, with regard to popularity, getting your message out, political campaigning, and all that.  Lopan and I have studied marketing, and we ran a small ad agency and marketing consulting firm (Lopan still runs it; I got out).

It's a question of execution, and as we all agree, Republicans execute beautifully.  Dems, as I said above, have a harder target audience to work with, and they also have a harder time finding consensus and direction, because of their diversity of views.  Republicans only have to hit a few points: abortion, gay marriage, god, guns.  Nationalists, evangelicals, ethnocentrists of all stripes are conformist and "conventional" by their very nature, giving them a very powerful block vote and making them very easy to market to, so long as you're willing to share their (relatively unified) values.

mT, situations like these involve balancing the morality of the act or "thing-in-itself," and the morality of the practical outcome.  In some philosophical circles, they're referred to as deontology vs. consequentialism: what's more important to you, not playing dirty and potentially losing as a result, or playing dirty so you can make the world less dirty when you win?  (And there are also degrees of dirty.) These sorts of balancing acts can be found in positions on abortion, legalization of drugs and prostitution, death penalty, and a ton of "wedge" issues.  And they generally can't be reasoned through, because it's a value judgment: if a bad act can lead to a good result, how bad is the act?  And if a good act leads to a bad result, how good is it really?  Your position on that spectrum determines what you'll think is good/bad in a given non-ideal win-lose situation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think I implied that marketing is a simple thing, but I do think it&#8217;s an obvious point that it&#8217;s all about marketing, with regard to popularity, getting your message out, political campaigning, and all that.  Lopan and I have studied marketing, and we ran a small ad agency and marketing consulting firm (Lopan still runs it; I got out).</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a question of execution, and as we all agree, Republicans execute beautifully.  Dems, as I said above, have a harder target audience to work with, and they also have a harder time finding consensus and direction, because of their diversity of views.  Republicans only have to hit a few points: abortion, gay marriage, god, guns.  Nationalists, evangelicals, ethnocentrists of all stripes are conformist and &#8220;conventional&#8221; by their very nature, giving them a very powerful block vote and making them very easy to market to, so long as you&#8217;re willing to share their (relatively unified) values.</p>
<p>mT, situations like these involve balancing the morality of the act or &#8220;thing-in-itself,&#8221; and the morality of the practical outcome.  In some philosophical circles, they&#8217;re referred to as deontology vs. consequentialism: what&#8217;s more important to you, not playing dirty and potentially losing as a result, or playing dirty so you can make the world less dirty when you win?  (And there are also degrees of dirty.) These sorts of balancing acts can be found in positions on abortion, legalization of drugs and prostitution, death penalty, and a ton of &#8220;wedge&#8221; issues.  And they generally can&#8217;t be reasoned through, because it&#8217;s a value judgment: if a bad act can lead to a good result, how bad is the act?  And if a good act leads to a bad result, how good is it really?  Your position on that spectrum determines what you&#8217;ll think is good/bad in a given non-ideal win-lose situation.</p>
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		<title>By: minorTruths</title>
		<link>http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7289</link>
		<dc:creator>minorTruths</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 Aug 2008 02:10:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7289</guid>
		<description>I kinda like the idea that Obama can be “above the fray”.  Isn’t it part of his “no more politics as usual” platform?  It’s ideal and not practical.  But there’s something compelling about that.  Good vs. evil.  Then again, win the office first, and then worry about morals, ethics, and change.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I kinda like the idea that Obama can be “above the fray”.  Isn’t it part of his “no more politics as usual” platform?  It’s ideal and not practical.  But there’s something compelling about that.  Good vs. evil.  Then again, win the office first, and then worry about morals, ethics, and change.</p>
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		<title>By: Lordonlow</title>
		<link>http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7288</link>
		<dc:creator>Lordonlow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Aug 2008 18:48:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7288</guid>
		<description>Not to denigrate you, but it's much more than just saying, "Of course it's marketing."  If it's that simple, why haven't the democraps figured it out?  Even most large corporations, imo, don't understand marketing, (examples are legion; webtv and betamax come to mind) and on the smaller level, the vast majority of start-ups fail.  And I believe in large part it's because they don't *really* understand marketing.  and the vast majority of non-profits are just clueless in this area.  Therefore they're always begging for money, rather than figuring out how to be self-sufficient.

It's also one thing to say that the retardicans are "geniuses" but quite another to understand the genius of their marketing practices.

Gambling is a good analogy.  Casino house games give the edge - a very slight edge on average - to the house.  Take roulette.  It's a 1:1 payout on black/red, or odd/even.  Is that an even bet?  Of course not.  Why?  Because of the green 0 and 00.  It's a slight edge, but it's there, and it pays.

Same with courting the religious right.

And, like good marketers, once they have determined their audience, they formulate a strategy for messaging.  Sticking with the religious right, it can be boiled down to one word: "outrage."  retardicans are "outraged" over higher taxes, welfare moms, gay marriage, and affirmative action (the so-called "reverse racism").  Then they label/demonize it "liberal."

Besides being evil, they are nothing of not clever.  Mix in their aggressive mentality plus their understanding of marketing dynamics and mechanics and they really have it down.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not to denigrate you, but it&#8217;s much more than just saying, &#8220;Of course it&#8217;s marketing.&#8221;  If it&#8217;s that simple, why haven&#8217;t the democraps figured it out?  Even most large corporations, imo, don&#8217;t understand marketing, (examples are legion; webtv and betamax come to mind) and on the smaller level, the vast majority of start-ups fail.  And I believe in large part it&#8217;s because they don&#8217;t *really* understand marketing.  and the vast majority of non-profits are just clueless in this area.  Therefore they&#8217;re always begging for money, rather than figuring out how to be self-sufficient.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s also one thing to say that the retardicans are &#8220;geniuses&#8221; but quite another to understand the genius of their marketing practices.</p>
<p>Gambling is a good analogy.  Casino house games give the edge - a very slight edge on average - to the house.  Take roulette.  It&#8217;s a 1:1 payout on black/red, or odd/even.  Is that an even bet?  Of course not.  Why?  Because of the green 0 and 00.  It&#8217;s a slight edge, but it&#8217;s there, and it pays.</p>
<p>Same with courting the religious right.</p>
<p>And, like good marketers, once they have determined their audience, they formulate a strategy for messaging.  Sticking with the religious right, it can be boiled down to one word: &#8220;outrage.&#8221;  retardicans are &#8220;outraged&#8221; over higher taxes, welfare moms, gay marriage, and affirmative action (the so-called &#8220;reverse racism&#8221;).  Then they label/demonize it &#8220;liberal.&#8221;</p>
<p>Besides being evil, they are nothing of not clever.  Mix in their aggressive mentality plus their understanding of marketing dynamics and mechanics and they really have it down.</p>
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		<title>By: Dialectic</title>
		<link>http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7285</link>
		<dc:creator>Dialectic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Aug 2008 21:53:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7285</guid>
		<description>I don't think Grant would disagree with the essence of what you're saying, and neither do I.  Of course it's marketing.  And to be fair, the Republicans have it much easier, with their conformist evangelical base: hit a few key points on abortion and gay rights, and then a couple others on guns and energy, and you're done.

The Democrats are dealing with liberal pluralists, who are by their very nature a diverse, fractured, contentious, and cynical bunch.

At any rate, the more I think about the choice of Palin as VP, the more I appreciate Republican genius.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think Grant would disagree with the essence of what you&#8217;re saying, and neither do I.  Of course it&#8217;s marketing.  And to be fair, the Republicans have it much easier, with their conformist evangelical base: hit a few key points on abortion and gay rights, and then a couple others on guns and energy, and you&#8217;re done.</p>
<p>The Democrats are dealing with liberal pluralists, who are by their very nature a diverse, fractured, contentious, and cynical bunch.</p>
<p>At any rate, the more I think about the choice of Palin as VP, the more I appreciate Republican genius.</p>
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		<title>By: Lordonlow</title>
		<link>http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7283</link>
		<dc:creator>Lordonlow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Aug 2008 21:19:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thefighting44s.com/archives/2008/08/28/676/#comment-7283</guid>
		<description>There is so much - SO much - that can be argued either way with many if not all of his points.  Particularly his thesis that the democraps want to be "like." [sic]  I find that just cheap journalism, a way of (mildly, haha) spicing up his article.

Sorry but I thought his article was rather dull, dredging up things (essentially, "fighting back") that I as well as all of my political-junkie friends have been saying for eons.

democrap incompetence/impotence/limp wrists aside, what the retardicans *TRULY* get is.... marketing.

On that last point, everyone now knows who Rove is, and I suppose he deserves credit in the religious right targeting.  Or at least his role in it.  But there's another dude that people should be aware of.

Frank Luntz.

Look him up.  As a marketer and insofar as what he addresses (marketing-wise), the dude knows what he's talking about.

All this is to say that as far as marketing goes, the retardicans are playing at another level that the democraps just don't seem to get.  And in the battle for election that is amerkian politics, that's where a major portion of the fight is.  The retardicans figured that out.  Quite a while ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is so much - SO much - that can be argued either way with many if not all of his points.  Particularly his thesis that the democraps want to be &#8220;like.&#8221; [sic]  I find that just cheap journalism, a way of (mildly, haha) spicing up his article.</p>
<p>Sorry but I thought his article was rather dull, dredging up things (essentially, &#8220;fighting back&#8221;) that I as well as all of my political-junkie friends have been saying for eons.</p>
<p>democrap incompetence/impotence/limp wrists aside, what the retardicans *TRULY* get is&#8230;. marketing.</p>
<p>On that last point, everyone now knows who Rove is, and I suppose he deserves credit in the religious right targeting.  Or at least his role in it.  But there&#8217;s another dude that people should be aware of.</p>
<p>Frank Luntz.</p>
<p>Look him up.  As a marketer and insofar as what he addresses (marketing-wise), the dude knows what he&#8217;s talking about.</p>
<p>All this is to say that as far as marketing goes, the retardicans are playing at another level that the democraps just don&#8217;t seem to get.  And in the battle for election that is amerkian politics, that&#8217;s where a major portion of the fight is.  The retardicans figured that out.  Quite a while ago.</p>
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